New Yorkers leave for states with lower taxes

[WNYresident]

New Yorkers leave for states with lower taxes

Lynn Fahlen owned a home in a New York hamlet so appealing it could have been pictured on the cover of a tourism guide.

Just the name — Groveland — produced visions of verdant rolling hills nestled in the middle of the state’s agricultural hub. Her residence sat on the western edge of New York’s picturesque Finger Lakes region, a short drive from the state’s notable wineries and pristine waters of Conesus and Hemlock lakes.
Then, the 52-year-old moved herself, her horses, dogs and cats from her longtime residence to Sagertown, Pa., 180 miles southeast of her former home.
“Oh my god, what a difference,” Fahlen said of the cross-border defection. The New York native is talking taxes — New York’s burdensome property taxes. Her tax bill is now 60 percent less: from $5,000 a year to $2,000.

http://www.democratandchronicle.com/...axes/84212658/

[WNYresident]

“I just don’t care what (Gov. Andrew) Cuomo says, people are moving out in droves,” Fahlen said. “The numbers don’t lie.”

The numbers also don't reflect exactly what is going on. IE: Erie County.

This article is old but importing refugees that add to our Erie County Social Services costs just makes your property taxes higher.

Immigrants end the decline in Erie County population

Large refugee influx leads to first increase since 1960s

WASHINGTON – Erie County’s population has started to grow slightly again after decades of decline, and it’s almost entirely because so many people are moving to town from overseas.

The county’s population as of last April was 922,835, an increase of 0.4 percent from the 2010 census, according to a new set of county population estimates released Thursday by the U.S. Census Bureau.

While that’s a modest population increase, it is also the first time since the 1960s that an upward population trend has developed in Erie County. What’s more, Erie County was the only county in Western New York to witness a population increase in the first four years of the decade.

http://www.buffalonews.com/city-regi...ation-20150326

And it never would have happened without a huge influx of refugees and other immigrants. According to the Census Bureau, 12,196 people from other countries moved to Erie County between 2010 and 2014 – more than making up for the fact that the county suffered a net loss of 8,394 longtime residents who decided to move away.

Out of that 12,196 (number is higher now) how many received social services "services" that county property owners cover the cost for?

Add it all up, and the new Census numbers show a positive trend, said County Executive Mark C. Poloncarz.

“It shows once again the continuing success we’ve had in creating and growing the county,” Poloncarz said. “The population growth is not huge, but compared to the loss of population in recent decades, it’s a good thing.”

Success? Really? Importing refugees that require social services at the current property owners expense is "success"?




GRUMP?


I would like to hear your opinion about this.

[300miles]

from your article:

"School taxes represent the largest portion of a property-tax bill: about 60 percent of the total annual tab. And voters will head to poll May 17 to vote on their school budgets."

If the largest portion of the tax bill is directly controlled by local voters, why do they keep approving new spending? I know you like to blame the other political party, and blame county immigration, and blame Albany... but local voters have a direct say in a huge chunk of their own tax bill, and yet year after year they keep approving whatever the schools put in front of them. If taxes are so important, why don't voters say that with their school-spending votes?

[Save Us]

from your article:

"School taxes represent the largest portion of a property-tax bill: about 60 percent of the total annual tab. And voters will head to poll May 17 to vote on their school budgets."

If the largest portion of the tax bill is directly controlled by local voters, why do they keep approving new spending? I know you like to blame the other political party, and blame county immigration, and blame Albany... but local voters have a direct say in a huge chunk of their own tax bill, and yet year after year they keep approving whatever the schools put in front of them. If taxes are so important, why don't voters say that with their school-spending votes?

Voters may have a chance to delay increases but lowering taxes enough to make people stay? Not a snowball's chance.

compare those municipalities in the US controlled by Democrats vs those by republicans. Yes you can blame a party.

[WNYresident]

from your article:

"School taxes represent the largest portion of a property-tax bill: about 60 percent of the total annual tab. And voters will head to poll May 17 to vote on their school budgets."

If the largest portion of the tax bill is directly controlled by local voters, why do they keep approving new spending? I know you like to blame the other political party, and blame county immigration, and blame Albany... but local voters have a direct say in a huge chunk of their own tax bill, and yet year after year they keep approving whatever the schools put in front of them. If taxes are so important, why don't voters say that with their school-spending votes?

Put a vote to cut the budget by lets say 20% and see how it's voted on. Aim the cuts at salaries/benefit costs starting at the administration level of all government service monopolies. Don't do the BS we see when they say "If we cut spending you will lose this or that program". Cut salaries and benefits and keep the programs going. Issues are the compensation packages in many cases not all have gotten out of hand. Real reviews when it comes to waste in government. It would be different if we weren't losing net tax payer population but we are. Importing refugees that require we pay for their care do not count as true population growth.

[300miles]

Voters may have a chance to delay increases ...

Not just delay... voters can stop school tax increases. But the don't. Why? It's the easiest and most direct way to control taxes, but instead voters almost always approve the increases. Then they turn around and blame somebody else for their high taxes because that's easier to do.

Put a vote to cut the budget by lets say 20% and see how it's voted on.

They already have a vote every single year on the school budget. You have to admit that the residents themselves must share some of the blame in all this.

[HipKat]

Res touched on it. When the budget doesn't pass, they cut sports, bussing, after school programs, etc so the kids suffer

[300miles]

That frustration is understandable, but then it gets back to whether it's really a huge concern to residents. Which one is worse, continuing to pay the highest taxes of any town, or dealing with the loss of highschool football for a season? People refuse to give anything up in the fight, so they give-up and let towns take whatever they want. People are basically saying "high taxes suck, but they don't suck as much as losing other things temporarily". Which means, they're essentially OK with the high taxes.

Plus I think there's a high percentage of people that are brainwashed into thinking more money for "education" is good money spent, even if they have no clue where the money is actually going.

[Save Us]

That frustration is understandable, but then it gets back to whether it's really a huge concern to residents. Which one is worse, continuing to pay the highest taxes of any town, or dealing with the loss of highschool football for a season? People refuse to give anything up in the fight, so they give-up and let towns take whatever they want. People are basically saying "high taxes suck, but they don't suck as much as losing other things temporarily". Which means, they're essentially OK with the high taxes.

Plus I think there's a high percentage of people that are brainwashed into thinking more money for "education" is good money spent, even if they have no clue where the money is actually going.

I agree with much of what you said, however we are still saddled with high income taxes, sales taxes, cigarette taxes, gasoline taxes, estate taxes, mortgage taxes, highway tolls, business taxes, self employment taxes for some of us, village taxes, garbage fees in the city.etc etc etc.

Face it, NY has all sorts of taxes and those taxes that are similar to other states are usually higher here, and when median realized household income has been stagnant,, people end up leaving. Now we just get refugees making up growth....between that and government being the largest employer that is not a good thing in my opinion.

That's why forums like SUWNY are a good thing. In the late 1700's there were poems, songs, plays, articles, woodcuts, posts, bills, effigies, protests over taxes. Now today that would be sedition .

[WNYresident]

Res touched on it. When the budget doesn't pass, they cut sports, bussing, after school programs, etc so the kids suffer

EXACTLY. He knew what I was referring to.

[WNYresident]

Not just delay... voters can stop school tax increases. But the don't. Why? It's the easiest and most direct way to control taxes, but instead voters almost always approve the increases. Then they turn around and blame somebody else for their high taxes because that's easier to do.


They already have a vote every single year on the school budget. You have to admit that the residents themselves must share some of the blame in all this.

Word the budgets differently and show real cuts.

[300miles]

Word the budgets differently

Budgets are budgets. I don't think you can word them differently. Maybe you could have an independent group give an overview to voters that is neutral to the school board

and show real cuts

They have no incentive to do that. Voters will approve every budget put in front of them... even the ones with tax increases. There is no incentive for them to show cuts.

[WNYresident]

Budgets are budgets. I don't think you can word them differently. Maybe you could have an independent group give an overview to voters that is neutral to the school board


They have no incentive to do that. Voters will approve every budget put in front of them... even the ones with tax increases. There is no incentive for them to show cuts.

If you laid the budget out with a 20% cut in salaries across the board and didn't threaten to cut sports, bussing etc... people would vote for it. Specially when they watch their friends and family moving to lower taxed areas. Specially when they are living within their means yet still have issue staying afloat.

[nogods]

Apparently those who are leaving aren't as smart as Donald Trump.

[300miles]

I agree with much of what you said, however we are still saddled with high income taxes, sales taxes, cigarette taxes, gasoline taxes, estate taxes, mortgage taxes, highway tolls, business taxes, self employment taxes for some of us, village taxes, garbage fees in the city.etc etc etc. .

But people have to start somewhere, right? If the residents of Cheektowaga can't even say no to school tax increases (which is 60% of their town tax) then the rest sounds like a lost cause. There's an argument to go for the low-hanging fruit first. Get some successes that will stop taxes from increasing more. No, it won't solve all the taxation problems, but it's better than just throwing our hands up in the air while complaining about what somebody else isn't doing.

To me it seems that the ever increasing school taxes just prove to Albany that we aren't really serious about wanting to cut taxes.