Proposed Buffalo Skyline Gondola Route – and a Final Push

[WNYresident]

Proposed Buffalo Skyline Gondola Route – and a Final Push

May 12, 2015 Posted by queenseyes In City, Regional Comments 53

I admit it. I’m completely hooked on the Buffalo gondola idea. There’s something about the image of gondolas transporting visitors from the Inner Harbor to the Outer Harbor that I just can’t get out of my mind. And I’m not alone. I can’t tell you the number of young Buffalonians who have come up to me to inquire whether the gondola concept is possible. The unique transportation system has lit a spark in the eyes of people who never dreamed that something like this would be possible.

http://buffalorising.com/2015/05/pro...t-minute-push/


Well that is something different.

[WNYresident]

This article is a List of gondola lifts around the world. A gondola lift has cabins suspended from a continuously circulating cable whereas aerial trams simply shuttle back and forth on cables. (Both are cable cars, and both are aerial lifts which also includes chairlifts.)


(Note: this list should not contain aerial tramways or chairlifts.)


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...Other_gondolas

[WNYresident]

Peak 2 Peak Gondola

The Peak 2 Peak Gondola is a tri-cable gondola lift located in Whistler, British Columbia that links Whistler Mountain's Roundhouse Lodge with Blackcomb Mountain's Rendezvous Restaurant.

28 gondola cabins
Capacity: 4,100 people per hour
Line Speed: 7.5 metres per second (16.8 miles per hour)
Ride Time: 11 minutes

[WNYresident]

Skypods: Are gondolas the next big thing in urban transport?
September 18, 2014

(CNN) -- Urban transport in Bolivia's administrative capital of La Paz has always been about what goes up and down.

Situated in a deep canyon more than 10,000 feet above sea level, the Andean metropolis is one of the highest cities in the world. Densely populated barrios (neighborhoods) occupy the hills encompassing the bustling city center, rising a further 1,400 feet towards the satellite town of El Alto.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/13/busine...ban-transport/

The La Paz urban gondola will consist of three separate service lines stretching across a combined 10.7 kilometer (6.1 mile) area of the city.

These giant structures, most commonly associated with ski-resorts or mountaintop tourist spots, will cater for a combined hourly capacity of 9,000 passengers and come in at a reported cost of $235 million dollars.

[nogods]

Would it need to be closed more often than the skyway because of weather factors? What will it cost to operate and maintain? A bridge would accommodate vehicles, bikes, and pedestrians with the maximum flexibility as to stop points, but a gondola only transports pedestrians between two set locations. so comparing the cost is not relevant. Perhaps the better comparison would be to a a gondola boat system like those in Venice.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Buffalo would do well to spend the money on making the outer harbor much more of a destination first than building transportation to it.

I think the Outer Harbor should start 'small' by building another complex similar to the Pier but adding an stage complex similar to what's found at Darian Lake. You would not do the seating, so the entire setup would be lawn outside of the stage and facilities.

Think of the awesomeness of ArtPark concerts but on ROIDS. I honestly think Buffalo could build a venue that has a similar iconic status to Red Rocks outside of Denver or Central Park in NYC. With the right promoter behind it and booking the right bands, you could draw all the way from Toronto to Pittsburgh. There could be spin off where Buffalo is featured as an amazing summer destination, which it really is. Due to the location you could have concerts or festivals that go late into the night, which is not allowed in the majority of the venues due to the proximity to residential.

The best part is that when the 'lawn' is not in use it could be open to the public and the revenue from the venue could fund development on the outer harbor for other areas....and maybe eventually a gondola.

Imagine a photo taken from the air that shows hundreds of boats in the foreground with the backdrop of 60,000 people on the outer harbor at sunset with some of the biggest bands in the world on stage. THAT is better than any stupid 'pro-buffalo' video or promotional piece that the powers that be could create.

[Linda_D]

Buffalo would do well to spend the money on making the outer harbor much more of a destination first than building transportation to it.

BINGO!!! So, what are you going to do when you get off the gondola at the Outer Harbor without a bike or a car? Until/unless there are things for pedestrians to do on the OH, which means venues very close to the river, it's stupid to build pedestrian-only transportation systems to get there.

[WNYresident]

28 gondola cabins
Capacity: 4,100 people per hour
Ride Time: 11 minutes

I was looking at the possible capacity.

If you were going to have an event that had 30,000 people and 20,000 wanted to ride the gondola...

20,000 / 4,100 = 4.87 hours to move all 20,000 people.

I wonder how much you can charge per trip.

$2 bucks a ride?

20,000 X $2 = $40,000 per event.

The aerial gondola is proposed because it reaches a high altitude quickly (unlike a bridge) for the fraction of the cost of a fixed crossing (about $22 – 60 million or so versus $100-200+ for a lift bridge). High standardization of the components helps keep the price low. Accordingly, gondola systems are found throughout the world in virtually every environment.

http://buffalorising.com/2015/05/mor...ndola-skyline/

Now we know how projects end up in Erie County when the tax payers foot the bill. They rarely come in under budget.

We'll use the $60,000,000 figure.

If there were 3 events per week 1/2 of the year.

4 weeks X 3 event X 6 months = 72 events.

If the gondola was used at maximum capacity and people didn't mind arriving 5 hours before each event and waiting 5 hours after the event to get back....

$40,000 gross profit per event.

72 X $40,000 = $2,880,000 per year.

Deduct operational cost and labor cost.

Even if we don't deduct operational cost it would take ($60,000,000 / $2,880,000 annual GROSS revenue) about 21 years to get the investment back.

Add on top of the initial building cost the operational cost it may have to be subsidized from from day one.

I wonder what the highest fee someone would be willing to pay to ride the Gondola car. Could it be marketed to tourist for $20 a ride? Maybe get each gondola graphically wrapped and sell advertising to lawyers.

Seeing we have "green" people in the area I wonder if Buffalo can be the first peddle power Gondola ride. Maybe not. I'd hate to be the only rider having to peddle. Or we have peddle power parks ( say that three times as fast as you can) all throughout Buffalo. Little electric generators mounted on exercise bikes all connected to the gondola ride.

[nogods]

Maybe get each gondola graphically wrapped and sell advertising to lawyers.

The single number lawyers will want to put their ads on the ground so the people in a falling gondola can text them before they splatter on the ground.

[WNYresident]

Funny.

Well for safety reasons there could be a gondola conductor in each car that babysits the door.

I wonder how much electric it would use to operate the ride along with heating the cars during cold weather.

Are gondola's handicap accessible?

Would people be willing to park and ride?

You could start up another revenue stream if you offered parking at one end of the ride.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

I think it's pretty silly to be concerned about weather when discussing gondolas...which are most often used on mountains in the winter.....

[nogods]

I think it's pretty silly to be concerned about weather when discussing gondolas...which are most often used on mountains in the winter.....

the location of a mountain gondola is usually chosen to avoid exposure to the worst of winter winds. A gondola along the lake shore won't have that option.

[Linda_D]

the location of a mountain gondola is usually chosen to avoid exposure to the worst of winter winds. A gondola along the lake shore won't have that option.

Exactly. Obviously the author of the piece and other "fans" have never tried to walk down lower Main Street from the HSBC Tower (or whatever it may be called now) to the FNC in windy weather. There's a reason there's a wind farm on the Lake Erie shore.

[WNYresident]

I think it's pretty silly to be concerned about weather when discussing gondolas...which are most often used on mountains in the winter.....

Totally agree on that topic.

[nogods]

Then you would be as wrong as outofWNY because gondola's are designed to avoid mountain winds and are not used in high winds,.

Idaho: Another former employee, Robert LaFleur, said he and others saw safety infractions and maintenance shortcuts but kept quiet out of fear of losing their jobs. Even after leaving his job in 2004 as a gondola and lift operator, LaFleur said, he did not want to talk about problems he saw, including the gondola being operated in winds up to 56 mph – despite guidelines that call for shutting it down at lower wind speeds – and several occasions when the gondola’s automatic safety shutoff features were bypassed to keep the system running.

New Hampshire: The Wildcat Gondola, Wildcat's trademark for many years, was the first lift of this type to be erected in the U.S. It opened for operation during the 1957-58 ski season on January 25, 1958. It was carried by twenty-three towers which kept the lift close to the contours of the mountain, helping to protect the lift from winds.

Though winter riders would enjoy the protection from the elements that a gondola provides the cabins aren't as resistant to the winter winds as open chairs and the gondola runs at half the speed of the chair lift – fine for peepers, but not for transportation.

Steamboat Springs, CO: In January 1972 an empty, descending cabin was dislodged from the cables by gale-force winds at Tower Three, landing at the side of Heavenly Daze. Because the winds threatened other lifts, much of the area was forced to close for the day leaving skiers with little to do but watch the evacuation of 140 people from the gondola over the next six hours.

Seattle, WA: The reason gondolas “break down” is typically from wind. High wind gusts on mountain tops cause gondola operators to slow or stop the line to wait for safe conditions. This is especially true with one cable gondolas, like the Excelerator and the Whistler.

And other hazards more likely along a lake front:

Lightning Strike Shuts Down Gondola System Leaving Tourists Stranded for Hours