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Thread: Amherst State Park - Would you obey the law every other day?

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    Member nogods's Avatar
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    Amherst State Park - Would you obey the law every other day?

    The unleashed dog problem in Amherst State Park was on the front page of the News today. There appears to be a significant number of people who refuse to obey the law. Presently the only solution seems to be stepped up enforcement and increased fines.

    But perhaps there is another way:

    If you are the type of person who would let your dog off leash despite the posted signs and local laws, would you be more likely to obey the law leash laws in Amherst State Park if it was changed to every other day?

    If the law was changed so dogs were prohibited in the park on odd numbered days and were allowed in the park off leash on even numbered days, would you be more likely or less likely to obey the law?

    What if dogs were allowed in the park on all days, but could only be off leash on even numbered days? Would you be more likely to obey the law on the odd numbered days or would you still ignore it?

    If most people would just break the law anyways, then the town and state have no incentive to change the law. Instead, they will direct their efforts to stricter enforcement, highr fines, and the like.

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    .......
    Last edited by buffy; October 15th, 2009 at 03:22 PM.

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    Member CAugust's Avatar
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    why every other day? Isnt that giving in? I dont let my dog run loose - if you have no backyard and you dont want to just walk your dog, you should not have gotten a dog - you should have gotten a cat.

    These cops should start writing tickets to these irresponsible animal owners imho. When you got a dog, you understood the rules, period.

    I have a dog - she's great - she is not unleashed unless she is in my backyard or a friends yard. If i see someone at a park I tell them its the law that your dog be put on a lease - I HATE when some strange dog comes bounding over to mine .......... and I have no idea how they are going to behave.
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    Unregistered Cgoodsp466's Avatar
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    Wait there is a Amherst State Park? Where might this be please?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cgoodsp466 View Post
    Wait there is a Amherst State Park? Where might this be please?
    From wicki

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amherst_State_Park

    Amherst State Park is a small park in Erie County, New York, USA. The park is partially in the Village of Williamsville with the balance located in the Town of Amherst on land formerly belonging to a convent and surrounding property of the Franciscan Sisters. The park is northeast of Buffalo, New York.

    The area was formerly called "Williamsville Glen."

    The park consists of 77 acres (310,000 m2) next to Ellicott Creek. Nature trails and biking trails are available for the general public. The main access point is at 400 Mill Street in Williamsville.
    The internet is our friend
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    Unregistered Cgoodsp466's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by steven View Post
    From wicki

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amherst_State_Park



    The internet is our friend
    And you aint one of mine.

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    Member cheekman's Avatar
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    people can't follow rules. i have been there a # of times lots of dogs are off there leashes or they don't pick up the pooooo.
    God must love stupid people; He made so many

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cgoodsp466 View Post
    you aint one of mine.
    Whew, thats gonna keep me up at nights



    Back on subject. Is there a "dog park" in the surrounding area?
    People who wonder if the glass is half empty or full miss the point. The glass is refillable.

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    Member nogods's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAugust View Post
    why every other day? Isnt that giving in? I dont let my dog run loose - if you have no backyard and you dont want to just walk your dog, you should not have gotten a dog - you should have gotten a cat.

    These cops should start writing tickets to these irresponsible animal owners imho. When you got a dog, you understood the rules, period.

    I have a dog - she's great - she is not unleashed unless she is in my backyard or a friends yard. If i see someone at a park I tell them its the law that your dog be put on a lease - I HATE when some strange dog comes bounding over to mine .......... and I have no idea how they are going to behave.
    I agree, it should be simple. obey the law or get a hefty fine. well, i might give a warning the first time, then a ticket the second time, then jail and take away the dog the third time.

    But...we have to look at the reality. The state and the town do not have the resources to enforce the law as written.

    If half the days were taken off the enforcement calendar, then perhaps a lot of people would not violate the law on the other days, and the costs of enforcement would be cut in half. Moreover, the fines for violations could be increased substantially for the no-dogs days, and people who don't want to be around dogs could enjoy the park at least half the time - right now they can't enjoy the park any of the time.

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    Member CAugust's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nogods View Post
    I agree, it should be simple. obey the law or get a hefty fine. well, i might give a warning the first time, then a ticket the second time, then jail and take away the dog the third time.

    But...we have to look at the reality. The state and the town do not have the resources to enforce the law as written.

    If half the days were taken off the enforcement calendar, then perhaps a lot of people would not violate the law on the other days, and the costs of enforcement would be cut in half. Moreover, the fines for violations could be increased substantially for the no-dogs days, and people who don't want to be around dogs could enjoy the park at least half the time - right now they can't enjoy the park any of the time.
    they wont obey them - most of them think they are above the law - do you know who I am???? Ive heard this numerous times in this community.

    and the cops are not that busy here - let them give out a few tickets and see what happens = but they need the judge behind them to enforce the fines or it wont work. The cops do a fantastic job, but I do think they have the resources to go over there once a day for an hour to hand out tickets imho and while we are at it - let them go to bassett as well ......... I am disgusted with these owners ........ I am waiting for a dog to bite mine so I can kick it in the head (out of self defense of course, I would never hurt an animal just for kicks) and then watch them try to sue me .... trouble is, in these days, they would probably win.
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    Member buffy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nogods View Post
    I agree, it should be simple. obey the law or get a hefty fine. well, i might give a warning the first time, then a ticket the second time, then jail and take away the dog the third time.

    But...we have to look at the reality. The state and the town do not have the resources to enforce the law as written.

    If half the days were taken off the enforcement calendar, then perhaps a lot of people would not violate the law on the other days, and the costs of enforcement would be cut in half. Moreover, the fines for violations could be increased substantially for the no-dogs days, and people who don't want to be around dogs could enjoy the park at least half the time - right now they can't enjoy the park any of the time.
    enforcement? r u kidding me? is this why we pay the police so handsomely - to write tickets for a dog off its leash?

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    Member CAugust's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buffy View Post
    enforcement? r u kidding me? is this why we pay the police so handsomely - to write tickets for a dog off its leash?

    do you think it would take that much time away from their day? Do you think that the towns safety would suffer? curious

    I am not saying they need to put someone on dog patrol, but when cruising by to just stop to see what's going on.

    I am waiting for just one child to get bit by a dog off his lease in a park to see what happens, although I dont hope that happens.
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    Member nogods's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAugust View Post
    they wont obey them - most of them think they are above the law - do you know who I am???? Ive heard this numerous times in this community.

    ......... I am disgusted with these owners ........ I am waiting for a dog to bite mine so I can kick it in the head (out of self defense of course, I would never hurt an animal just for kicks) and then watch them try to sue me .... trouble is, in these days, they would probably win.
    Under NYS law, anyone who witnesses a dog "attacking" a person, another dog, or other domestic animal can immediately destroy the dog "and no liability in damages or otherwise shall be incurred on account of such destruction." NYS Agriculture and Markets Law section 121-a.

    The same law applies if the dog "behaves in a manner which a reasonable person would believe poses a serious and unjustified imminent threat of serious physical injury", but the "attack" language is broad enough to cover most situations where a dog is running towards or barking or growling at a person or dog.

    Note also that you can destroy the dog if you are just a witness to the attack, you don't have to be the victim of the attack.

    This is why people who let their dogs run free are risking their dogs health and well being.

    The same backpacker who recenly shot a bear cornering his girlfriend in the Adirondacks could just as easily have shot a dog approaching his girlfriend in an agressive manner. such a tragedy would be solely the fault of the dog's owner, and they should never again be allowed to own a dog.

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    Member nogods's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CAugust View Post
    do you think it would take that much time away from their day? Do you think that the towns safety would suffer? curious

    I am not saying they need to put someone on dog patrol, but when cruising by to just stop to see what's going on.

    I am waiting for just one child to get bit by a dog off his lease in a park to see what happens, although I dont hope that happens.
    We have an animal control officer for that purpose. But there are only two of them.

    However, the Master Plan for the Park anticipated "deputizing" town employees for enforcement of the park rules, so they could appoint some parks and rec personal to patrol the park and write tickets if need be.

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    Member Add It Up's Avatar
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    Maybe if the park encouraged more people without dogs to use it, we wouldn't have this problem. Until Amherst State Park is less destitute, with activities for the community that surrounds it, those who are seeking a place to let their dogs run free will continue to violate the law. Build a playground or activity center. Until then, it is just a large open space to run your dogs.

    Allowing off-leashers to use the park as a dog-park on any day exposes the Town to liability issues and is a law suit waiting to happen.

    Also, encourage those who do walk their dogs on leash in the park to use it responsibly. Add sites for poo bags and garbage containers.

    Enforce the law for the good of everyone.

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