Pataki flushes our toll money down the canal

[SolarEclipse]

http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/s...tml?from_rss=1

Recreational boaters won't have to pay tolls on the Erie Canal and the rest of New York's canal system this summer, Gov. George Pataki has announced as part of $10 million allocation to the waterway.

Waiving the tolls at locks is designed to help make the canals more attractive to recreational boaters, and the dollars they bring to spend in local businesses along the canals.

The New York State Canal Corporation currently issues two-day boater and 10-day recreational boater passes to cover fees which vary from $5 to $100 based on the size of the boat.

It will cost the canal corporation $200,000 to waive the recreational boater fees which will be offset by money transferred from the New York State Office of Parks, Recreation and Historic Preservation.

The state also will spend $10 million to promote the Erie Canal Greenway, the governor said during an event at the Waterford, N.Y., lock where the Erie Canal meets the Hudson River.

The canal system is run by the New York State Thruway Authority.

I'm so glad to know that this is where all our daily commuter tolls from the 190 are going. Giving boaters a free ride down the canal.

[Ragin]

"The canal system is run by the New York State Thruway Authority."
I'm so glad to know that this is where all our daily commuter tolls from the 190 are going. Giving boaters a free ride down the canal.

It costs $5.25 in tolls every week to get to and from my home .. and the recreational boater gets a free ride along the canal ...

Well sonovagun ..

[moonshine]

Ragin,

My wife keeps begging me to move to the island (she grew up there). I agreed if we could find a waterfront place with a dock as I plan to ride a jetski to work everyday. I'd be able to walk to my dock in the morning, jump on, and park at Harry's Harborplace. And on the way home I could stop at a few secluded islands to slam a 40-ounce, or shoot across the international border for some ballet.

[300miles]

This should only help Paladino's lawsuit against the state. They keep saying they can't afford to remove (or even relocate) the city tollbooths. Yet somehow it's OK to remove all tolls from the canal --- which is funded from the same pot as the highways??

That will be an interesting piece of evidence for Paladino's lawyers.

[Ragin]

Ragin,

My wife keeps begging me to move to the island (she grew up there). I agreed if we could find a waterfront place with a dock as I plan to ride a jetski to work everyday. I'd be able to walk to my dock in the morning, jump on, and park at Harry's Harborplace. And on the way home I could stop at a few secluded islands to slam a 40-ounce, or shoot across the international border for some ballet.

Moonshine,

Perhaps your wife is on to something. Sounds like you'd fit right in around here.

[WNYresident]

This should only help Paladino's lawsuit against the state. They keep saying they can't afford to remove (or even relocate) the city tollbooths. Yet somehow it's OK to remove all tolls from the canal --- which is funded from the same pot as the highways??

That will be an interesting piece of evidence for Paladino's lawyers.

I know exactly what to do.

We take all the net profit from those tolls and bank it. The net profit stops going to fund some political program immediately. The "political group" will also have no access to the funds. The funds will go into a non profit public bank account. That number will be made public as the funds go in so the community can see how thier investment is going. It's an investment because once the tolls are gone the community benefits from it. We relieve the community of that burden.

We get an accountant to monitor the revenue as it builds. We do not allow some government department monitor the money because from past experience we know most can't. Plus we all know once they got it they seem to give to someone else.

A lot of people will check the blog out because we'll be able to count up to the day the tolls are gone. If it's $10,000,000 to bulldoze and repave we'll have a good idea when it's gonna happen.

We'll get a quote to see how much it will cost to bull doze them down and replace the pads with ashphalt.

The union can do with the employees what they want. They can put them in another department of their toll booth business. Our goal is to remove the tolls.

I think I saw it posted but what was the yearly revenue those few tolls produced?

We'll have a blog that will display the monthly net revenue. We'll just watch it add up and when we hit what ever we need to remove the toll we remove it.

As the funds collect they are NOT used for anything except the removal of the tolls and the labor contract for the small group of people that man those tolls now until the bulldozer's hit.

I expect not a PEEP out of those preservation people either. There's no reason to save these things

Who can find me real numbers on the monthly take from the tolls we want removed? We factor out toll booth salaries and see what we have left. Other than safety reasons there will be no more maintaince on them to cut costs. The point is to just raise enough money to rip them down.

It's a simple idea really. It would work. Now you have to see who's fingers are in the purse strings of the revenue those tolls make.

[300miles]

I think the numbers have been posted before.... something like $10 million per year in revenue and $4 million in cost to run and maintain.

[WNYresident]

SO in one years time we can easily have the funds to remove the toll barriers and replace the pads with brand new asphalt. We'll even employee a WNY company to do the work.

I didn't know those tolls sucked that much money out of the community. How can the local elected officials allow this to continue for so long.

Is this something Bruno/Silver decid on in the long run? Or the Governor? Or is it the special interest group that is benefiting from the 10,000,000 a year.

[Ragin]

I didn't know those tolls sucked that much money out of the community. How can the local elected officials allow this to continue for so long.

They have no intention on removing the tolls. They are making additional EZ Pass lanes at the Williamsville, North Grand Island Bridge, and Lackawanna toll barriers so we can fly through them at 30mph instead of 5mph. That way the revenues add up more quickly.

[WNYresident]

Maybe it's time for civil dis-obedience.

I hear Home Depot is having a sale on saw-alls. Gas powered circular saws. Cut right through those toll booths.

Here's another thought. If the buffalo PD can block the 33 like they did last year why can't the community block the tolls? The cops didn't get arrested so the community won't either.

[SolarEclipse]

The problem with that, Res, is who you're trying to affect by taking such an action. In the case of the tolls, it's the Thruway Authority all the way out there in Albany. What do you think they're going to say to a group of Buffalonians slowing down their own trip home? They'll laugh, hop on their yachts, and putter along the canal for free for a week.

[crlachepinochet]

There´s a van with a flat tire that´s been sitting on my street for a week and a half now (without a ticket somehow). On behalf of the owner, I´ll gladly donate it to the cause!

I´m really interested in seeing how this lawsuit turns out. It seems like we should win, doesn´t it?

[DR_GONZO]

will be offset by money transferred from the New York State Office of Parks, Recreation and Historic Preservation.

Park fees, cabin rentals, fishing license fees, etc... will more than likely be increased now, and new fees created within the parks dept. so the few can enjoy a ditch filled with water. Thanks O-grand governor, thanks a bunch.

[concernedwnyer]

http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/s...tml?from_rss=1



I'm so glad to know that this is where all our daily commuter tolls from the 190 are going. Giving boaters a free ride down the canal.

Why not come up with a flat rate for all recreational watercraft??? I mean why is every decision that NY state officials make end up being either so far left field or so far right field. Never a sweet balanced decision by those people who most of you, not I, keep voting back into office. A reasonable fee to use the locks is a fair request but I cannot see why the fee is based on the size of the watercraft. Does it cost more money to open the valve and drain the bathtub to lower the water level for a larger boat then for a smaller boat??? What is up with the $10 per person charge for tour type boats???? That is a hefty fee…… See the extreme costs here… Come up with a reasonable flat fee not necessarily eliminate the fee for a short period of time.… Simple

[300miles]

Toll dollars floating away
Business First of Buffalo - April 3, 2006

This summer, nearly 267,000 drivers are going to float boaters a free ride.

When Gov. George Pataki announced recently that recreational boaters won't have to pay tolls this summer on the Erie Canal and the rest of New York's canal system, he left out an important detail: If you follow the money trail, it's drivers who will be paying for it.

The canal system is run by the New York State Thruway Authority, the same arrogant bureaucracy that levies an unfair amount of tolls on Buffalo Niagara drivers.

Giving boaters a free ride this summer will cost the canal system approximately $200,000. That's the amount of money the Thruway Authority will intake after slightly less than 267,000 drivers each pay 75 cents for the privilege of taking the I-190 through Buffalo or across Grand Island.

In effect, daily commuters are funding recreational boaters. And that's wrong.

In typical Albany fashion, the bureaucrats behind the Thruway Authority may be compelled to point out that the $200,000 is being offset by money transferred from the New York State Office of Parks, Recreation and Historic Preservation. Which is nice, except we'd then counter that if such money is available, use it to help tear down the toll booths that are plunked around the metro Buffalo area, starting with those on the I-190.

In no other upstate city do drivers pay for downtown travel. We shouldn't have to do it here, either.

Tearing down the toll booths is the one issue that unites leaders around Buffalo Niagara. Developer Carl Paladino is fighting it with a lawsuit. Erie County Executive Joel Giambra has joined him. The county Legislature is close to doing the same. Erie County Clerk David Swarts is fighting the issue. His aide, the Town of Hamburg Councilwoman Kathy Hochul, has been aggressively pursuing the Thruway Authority for nearly a decade. In fact, Thruway Authority officials are so upset by the sight of her that many of them didn't see fit to stick around for her testimony during a Buffalo hearing hosted by Assemblyman Sam Hoyt.

That personalizes the issue -- something Swarts says the Thruway Authority is known to do. Consider his recollection of a meeting with authority officials to discuss the tolls: "You felt as though when you walked into the room, you were the enemy. This defensive posture was established that prevented them from looking at the issue outside of their institutional mindset."

Swarts recalls one particular Thruway executive who took the disagreement "very personally. He was personally angry that I had the audacity to bring the issue up. But it's our right to bring up the issue."

And it's our right as well.

Every elected official and business group should speak in unison on this issue: The Thruway tolls must be removed from the I-190 and pushed outside of the Buffalo commuting area on the I-90. The Thruway Authority needs to streamline its operations. It can start by cutting off the canals - as a recent Canal Corp. recommended it do. To date, $575 million in Thruway money has been spent on the canals; they should be self-sustaining.

The person with the power to make these things happen is the governor. Let's hope the next one does better for us than Pataki.

- http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/s...ditorial1.html