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Thread: Should Zoar Valley become a state park?

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    Member Linda_D's Avatar
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    Should Zoar Valley become a state park?

    Years and years ago, back in the 1960s I think, there was a move to make the Zoar Valley a state park. It failed. Now there's increasing sentiment to do something about the injuries and deaths that occur annually in Zoar, especially along the South Branch of the Cattaraugus in the Forty Gorge, and making Zoar a state park is again an issue. I think just in July, 2005, two separate incidents resulted in a death and 2 serious injuries. The first responders are the Gowanda Volunteer Fire Department, and these rescues take a serious toll on the unit, both financially (many times the rescuers have to rapelle (sp) over the cliffs to reach victims, and their ropes fray on the hard shale so are only good for 1 rescue effort) and emotionally.

    There are pros and cons to creating a state park here. The state already owns considerable land in the area. I think it would need to purchase more in order to make the area safer, and would using its power of eminent domain against landowners who didn't want to sell be justified (see article)? Would making Zoar a state park actually make it safer or simply add regulations, especially for the thousands of local people who come to the gorge to picnic and swim? Would making Zoar a state park take the wildness out of the place and replace it with overlooks and hand rails and steps a la Letchworth?

    Would making Zoar a state park protect the only existing old-growth forest in WNY or would it make that forest more vulnerable by making it more accessible?

    Would the economic benefits of adding some well-paying full time jobs and numerous seasonal jobs as well as bringing more people to the Gowanda area offset the loss in tax revenues from lands bought by the state?

    FOCUS: ZOAR VALLEY
    Beauty conceals nature's hazards
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    By STEPHEN HAGENBUCH and ELMER PLOETZ
    News Staff Reporters
    8/8/2005

    Bridget Mazierski dreads July 31 every year. It was on that date in 1988 that her brother, Brian Mahoney, and his best friend, David Hughes, fell to their deaths in Zoar Valley.
    This year, she awoke July 31 to news reports that the day before, a young woman had died in a fall in Zoar.

    "It saddens me to think that this keeps happening to others," Mazierski said. "When will it stop?"

    That's a question law enforcement officials, area property owners and advocates for the forest itself would like answered. More important, what can be done about it?

    It's a timely question with the state Department of Environmental Conservation's unit management plan for New York State's 2,297 acres in Zoar - including much of Cattaraugus Creek and its surrounding cliffs - expected to be up for public review this fall.

    "Our two primary access points down into the Zoar Valley area, the parts that the state administers, harbor no real safety concerns," said Russell Biss, a DEC natural resources supervisor. "They both bring you down to the creek bottom level. But where many of the fatalities have occurred has been on private lands farther down Zoar Valley."

    But for the thousands who visit annually, Zoar is a place where beautiful memories - not tragic ones - are forged.

    Rudy Rote, a Gowanda native who now lives in Rockville, Md., visited the valley last week with his sons, Ryan, 15, and Devin, 10, who were lazily floating downstream in inner tubes.

    "You can just come down here and explore, go wherever you want to," he said, recalling a "Tom Sawyer-esque" youth of hiking and snowmobiling in Zoar. "That's the beauty of it. There's no signs pointing every little thing out."

    But that freedom comes with a risk. Zoar is, by nature, dangerous as well as beautiful.

    Lauren Castanza, of East Amherst, was the latest victim when she fell off a cliff July 30 near the point where state land becomes private. Other people who died fell, drowned or were hit by objects falling or thrown from the cliffs.

    Part of the problem is that Zoar is a wild area in a part of the world where nature has largely been domesticated. People from the city and suburbs aren't used to dealing with places where the pathways drop off into nothingness, shale cliffs can crumble under feet and floodwaters can turn a sandy campsite into an island in the middle of a raging torrent.

    But they aren't always warned, either. Most of the signs in the areas around the cliffs simply identify the land as state-owned; there's no mention of cliffs.

    Then there's the matter of where the state's land ends. Many of the more dangerous waterfalls are on the south branch of the Cattaraugus, beyond the state's property line.

    But it's difficult to tell where those lines are. Adjoining property owners are responsible for putting up posted signs if they want to keep people off, but visitors frequently make those signs disappear almost as soon as they're nailed or stapled onto the trees.

    Extreme dangers

    Most people in the park one day last week had no idea some paths and areas around waterfalls were on private land.

    Richard Shraven of Amherst, a longtime member of the Adirondack Mountain Club who has hiked along Zoar Valley's northern rim and gorge dozens of times, said, "Besides a sign for the Nature Conservancy, we haven't seen any signs ever."

    The state has marked much of its property line by marking the trees with paint, but the paint is on the adjoining property owners' sides of the trees. In some places, visitors wouldn't necessarily know they were off state property until they returned onto it.

    Zoar, with its 71/2 miles of canyon walls, is a place where knowledge is crucial. Capt. Kevin Caffery's first flight with the Erie County Sheriff Department's then-new Air 1 helicopter was into Zoar Valley after Mahoney and Hughes fell. He has returned many times since.

    "The thing people don't realize about Zoar Valley is if they start walking around the top of the cliffs, start climbing up them or if they're there when the water is high, they're in extreme danger," he said.

    "I've made rescues where people had spent the night on little islands, it's rained and the next thing you know there's a raging torrent and they're trapped on an island."

    Posting rules, risks

    While common sense is the usual suggestion for improved safety in the valley, sometimes it's not enough. Lauren Castanza was an experienced hiker, according to a family spokesman, and had been to Zoar dozens of times as well as hiking the Grand Canyon.

    But better education could make a difference, many say.

    The DEC's Biss said the draft management plan for Zoar, which is expected back from Albany for public hearings this fall, calls for informational kiosks there to let hikers know the rules and the risks of the valley.

    Laurence Beahan, an executive committee member of the Adirondack Mountain Club, said that group favors turning Zoar into a state park.

    "The public needs to be warned that it's dangerous there," he said, "and it needs to be told it's a vulnerable place that needs to be taken care of. I think we probably need more personnel, more rangers."

    The region's six forest rangers are currently stretched across the state's woodlands in six counties, although they have combined with Cattaraugus County sheriff's deputies, DEC officers and New York State troopers to make sweeps in Zoar this summer. The most recent resulted in 33 trespassing charges last weekend.

    Fred Parsell has lived at Zoar Valley since 1977. He says he remembers hearing the group Mahoney and Hughes were with when they went camping on state land that night. Overnight camping wasn't - and isn't - allowed in Zoar, and he considered calling police. But he and his wife decided not to because they didn't want to antagonize a group of teenagers.

    The next morning, he awoke to the strobe of a flashing light in their bedroom window. A police officer told him two boys had gone over the cliff.

    Ten years later, he says, a young couple from Fredonia State College was probably saved when the two followed the sound of his dog's barking after they got lost after dark near the cliffs.

    "They went in before dark, at the same place the kids went over," he said. "They came to go for a walk, and then they got disoriented. And there's something about humans, they always seem to want to circle to the right."

    Along the road near Parsell's house, there are signs that say, "attention small game hunters," "dog owners - restricted area," "state land" and "state forest." But there is nothing warning of the potential hazards nearby.

    "There probably should be more signage for these young people," he said. "They see "state land,' they don't see danger signs. They don't see cliffs. And in some places, it drops sheer down."

    "Experienced hikers know not to go near the edge at all, at least not all the way," said Shraven, the hiker. "The ground can fall away from you, you can lose your balance. A lot of things could go wrong."

    "The spot where people have died could have signs," said Joyce Bol, of Snyder, who was hiking with Shraven. "We could certainly have a few signs to warn us, something that indicates the ground is unstable."

    Stay on the state's lands

    Steve McCabe, who owns 1,300 feet of creek bank along the south branch of the Cattaraugus Creek, also would like to see an end to guides that point the way beyond state property.

    "It's strange in that they say it's private property, then they offer detailed directions on how to circumvent that and give detailed directions to get to places," he said. "Sadly, it has become a life and death issue. The irresponsibility of that just galls me."

    Scott Ensminger, whose map of Zoar Valley waterfalls made its way to the Internet, said he long ago stopped distributing it and that he would be ordering others who have posted it to take it off their Web sites.

    Ensminger, who runs the "Waterfalls of Western New York Survey" Web site, said he now directs people only to state and county properties in the falls quests.

    Whatever the results when the Zoar plan is finalized, it won't replace a dose of simple caution when it comes to preventing tragedies.

    "Nature will take its toll. You just have to respect nature," Rote said.
    Your right to buy a military weapon without hindrance, delay or training cannot trump Daniel Barden’s right to see his eighth birthday. -- Jim Himes

  2. #2
    Member citymouse's Avatar
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    Why can't we just leave it alone?
    People should respect the place and it's dangers.
    Making it a stste park will just mean added expense to the tax payer and probably more public use and access to the area.
    We should have some places where natural beauty should be allowed to reign. With all it's dangers and ruggedness.
    People should just stay away or be willing to bear the consequences.
    "If you want to know what God thinks of money just look at the people he gave it to."

    By the way, what happened to biker? I miss the old coot.

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    moonshine
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    Sell the entire site to the highest bidder, hopefully a logger. A greater supply of local hardwood would drive down the prices of building materials.

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    Member jbinbny's Avatar
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    Originally posted by moonshine
    Sell the entire site to the highest bidder, hopefully a logger. A greater supply of local hardwood would drive down the prices of building materials.


    Too much!
    Thank you New York, may I please have another!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  5. #5
    Member crlachepinochet's Avatar
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    When you're climbing up something and all of a sudden you realize the next ten feet will be almost impossible to scale or when things get really slippery or the rock is unstable (SHALE!!!), some people realize they are beaten and head down; some don't. It's almost Darwinian. I was at the Chimney Bluffs out past Rochester a couple of weeks ago, and everything is just kinda conglomerate... solid in some areas, not in others. It took my group three tries to find a good way up the rock face. I think most of the problem is that people are doing things that are beyond them. My solution: put in big signs that say LOOK DOWN!

    The appeal of Zoar is that it's mostly unspoiled and quirky: no marked trails, the nude beach, great waterfalls. It should stay that way as much as possible.
    Remain calm!! But run for your lives if necessary!

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    Originally posted by moonshine
    Sell the entire site to the highest bidder, hopefully a logger. A greater supply of local hardwood would drive down the prices of building materials.
    I'm going to give you the benefit if the doubt that you are either joking, or you've never been there, and seen how beautiful it is.

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    Re: Should Zoar Valley become a state park?

    Originally posted by Linda_D
    Years and years ago, back in the 1960s I think, there was a move to make the Zoar Valley a state park. It failed. Now there's increasing sentiment to do something about the injuries and deaths that occur annually in Zoar, especially along the South Branch of the Cattaraugus in the Forty Gorge, and making Zoar a state park is again an issue.
    Here we go again...trying to find a governmental/legislative solution to a few idiots.

    Christ All Friggin Mighty...WE WANT LESS GOVERNMENT...NOT MORE.

    Like crlachepinochet said...it's Darwinism at its finest.

    Let evolution do its thing and stop mucking with it.
    The difference between taxes and robbery is the mode of coercion.

  8. #8
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    BTW...turning to the government for public health and safety is like turning to a cigarette for vitamins.
    The difference between taxes and robbery is the mode of coercion.

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    Asking the government to put up a sign that says "Cliff ahead" is not all that unreasonable.

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    Originally posted by therising
    Asking the government to put up a sign that says "Cliff ahead" is not all that unreasonable.
    Either would doing it yourself if you're so concerned.
    The difference between taxes and robbery is the mode of coercion.

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    Originally posted by NoCtUrNaL
    Either would doing it yourself if you're so concerned.
    If you sensed concern in my post, then your powers of deduction need to be recalibrated.

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    Originally posted by therising
    If you sensed concern in my post, then your powers of deduction need to be recalibrated.
    No one expresses their opinion about an issue out of apathy.
    The difference between taxes and robbery is the mode of coercion.

  13. #13
    moonshine
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    I'm going to give you the benefit if the doubt that you are either joking, or you've never been there, and seen how beautiful it is.
    I was joking and serious at the same time. I also like pinochet's idea of using the site as an experiment in darwinism.

    I spent a good bit of time in the northwoods of maine and witnessed the benefits of private ownership of these types of sites. Without the paper companies there would not have been the infrastructure necessary to enjoy world class fly fishing, white water rafting, snowmobiling, and hunting. The paper companies were better stewards of the land than any government bureaucracy could ever dream.

    There is no reason for people to demand a government solution to these "problems". Furthermore, there is no reason for the government to own this land at all.

    I hear the western new york association of beavers is putting together a proposal for the site. "Dam it all" is their motto. Conversely, I've never been a big fan of beavers and I would hate to see their use plan win approval by the DEC. Nothing angers me more than a beaver with an agenda. Ever witness your tree-stand floating down the kennebec river because of some self-righteous beaver? I doubt it.

    Save the Trees, Eat a Beaver!

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    Member Linda_D's Avatar
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    I wasn't advocating a state park; I put the idea out there for comments. The idea of making the area a state park gets floated every five or ten years, especially after a number of accidents result in deaths, ever since the 1960s. More recently, the state park idea has gained more supporters because of the discovery, within the last four or five years, of a stand of ancient trees that are a remnant of the old growth forest that covered WNY before 1800.

    I'm really ambivalent about a state park. I grew up in the Zoar Valley area at the time when there was the original push to make it a state park. I own land in the area, and I have friends there, including some on the Gowanda VFD who have made numerous rescues and recoveries over the years. I'm not sure that the benefits (protecting people from their own stupidity, protecting old growth forest, some economic pluses) would outweigh the costs, especially the loss of its wildness and, as crlache said, its "quirkiness".
    Your right to buy a military weapon without hindrance, delay or training cannot trump Daniel Barden’s right to see his eighth birthday. -- Jim Himes

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    in the 60's mosty of zoar valley was bought up using eminent domain to place a giant damn and power project in. i know a few people who managed to buy large tracts of that land when the project was changed to only one damn in kinzua (sp) originally it was supposed to be three or four conbination recreations on power projects,lack of funding and safety concerns stopped the other three leaving just kinzua.
    My grandfather claimed he was in on this plan during the fifties but thought something illeagal was going on and sold out his shares befor the s--t hit the fan. other then that I am not sure if any real plans were ever made concerning a state park.
    One good thing about growing old is your secrets are safe with your friends they can't remember them either

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