Bflo: #1 in Black male joblessness

[Dougles]

I don't know for sure. The logical assumption is that the other stats aren't jaw droppingly obscene.

That's the point! If the Hispanics or asian or Arabs/people of middle eastern decent are THAT much lower we should know. The city should look to THEM to see why they are better off and try to use what they are doing!

[Dougles]

I personally think the education system has a lot to do with it. We need to bring back our trade school programs that have really gotten the shaft in recent years.

Secondly, Hurricane Katrina showed us that poor people can't afford to move or leave. I think that's a big deterrent to people leaving to find better jobs. They can't afford to support themselves in a new area while they're looking. They can't afford to commute back and forth to look for new jobs.

I can appreciate that people want us to become colorblind, but seriously, when 50% of a particular race is unemployed in your city, to not look at the race issue in some part is to ignore the white elephant in the room.

Why's the elephant gotta be white?

[FisherRd]

I can appreciate that people want us to become colorblind, but seriously, when 50% of a particular race is unemployed in your city, to not look at the race issue in some part is to ignore the white elephant in the room.

Which came fist, the chicken or the egg?


Are the 25% of the white males being discriminated against too?

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

I personally think the education system has a lot to do with it. We need to bring back our trade school programs that have really gotten the shaft in recent years.

Why? What good is a trade school in WNY when the trades work is not here? There is hardly ANY construction in the area...regardless of what list Brown comes up with. What is being done has a line already of workers. Why would you want to spend money on a program to train people in a skill that they can not use?

Secondly, Hurricane Katrina showed us that poor people can't afford to move or leave. I think that's a big deterrent to people leaving to find better jobs. They can't afford to support themselves in a new area while they're looking. They can't afford to commute back and forth to look for new jobs.

Really? Because from my understanding, the ranks of social services in NYS is added to by folks from out of state all of the time. If your claim were true, then NYS should have no problem with not allowing people to qualify for benefits unless they have resided and worked in NYS for at least a year. We both know this is not the case and will not change.

I can appreciate that people want us to become colorblind, but seriously, when 50% of a particular race is unemployed in your city, to not look at the race issue in some part is to ignore the white elephant in the room.

Good point.

[Bannister]

Which came fist, the chicken or the egg?


Are the 25% of the white males being discriminated against too?

I actually didn't use the word discrimination. You might assume that from the statistics, but the only thing we know for sure is black men are appallingly underemployed in this city. Is that due to discrimination, education, or some other reason we don't know? We need to start asking those questions.

Basically what that article is saying is between 25-50% of men in Buffalo are jobless and that is an atrocity no matter what way you look at it.

[Bannister]

Lefty are you saying we don't need anymore electricians, plumbers, auto mechanics, etc. in this area? I thought those were jobs that are always needed.

[Bannister]

Basically what that article is saying is between 25-50% of men in Buffalo are jobless and that is an atrocity no matter what way you look at it.

You know something else that has changed in recent years....

When kids or young men got arrested in years past, it went on their records as it does now. But with the advent of the internet, it is incredibly easy to do background checks on people. And everyone is doing it now, big businesses, small businesses. People who have done probation or served time can't really put it in their past as easily as they once could. Those kinds of things really follow you forever now.

I know employers say that if you explain it, they might give you a chance, but realistically I think people find that once you check the "yes" box you are disqualified from a lot of jobs.

It is so important as a parent for me to impress on my kids that they don't have the leeway to do anything stupid growing up. Hopefully they will know that anyway, but in today's society...past mistakes follow you for a looooonnnng time.

[Sock Puppet]

[Dougles]

Lefty are you saying we don't need anymore electricians, plumbers, auto mechanics, etc. in this area? I thought those were jobs that are always needed.

No, we ALWAYS need more government workers!

There are alot of jobs that people can be trained for, i know there are a lot of jobs that people have because there the best person for it, not the most qualified person, meaning they have the job beacuase it needed to be filled. They aren't the best workers but as someone said before they are one of the 3 that could fill out the application.

if we educated more people we may have 20 that can fill it out and a more qualifed person can get the job that is available!

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Lefty are you saying we don't need anymore electricians, plumbers, auto mechanics, etc. in this area? I thought those were jobs that are always needed.

No. What I am saying is we do not need to waste public education money on teaching the trades. If the region had $2M people and a healthy economy, I could see the need for a trade program. But we both know this is not the case.

Right now there is not enough work to go around for those already in the trade. The last thing we should do is crank out 100+ kids a year with skills but no market to hire those skills. If people really want to get into these trades...let them do it after HS. That was my point.

[Bannister]

No. What I am saying is we do not need to waste public education money on teaching the trades. If the region had $2M people and a healthy economy, I could see the need for a trade program. But we both know this is not the case.

Right now there is not enough work to go around for those already in the trade. The last thing we should do is crank out 100+ kids a year with skills but no market to hire those skills. If people really want to get into these trades...let them do it after HS. That was my point.

When I was in high school on Long Island, seniors had the option of taking classes through Boces during the class day in Nursing. There were kids who graduated from high school as a LPN. Why can't that be done today? This was in the early 90's so maybe nursing requirements have changed.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

When I was in high school on Long Island, seniors had the option of taking classes through Boces during the class day in Nursing. There were kids who graduated from high school as a LPN. Why can't that be done today? This was in the early 90's so maybe nursing requirements have changed.

I am sure it can be done. I have no problem with programs like this. I only see a challenge with what the skill learned is. Nursing is much different compared to plumbing.

I would be all for an intense computer program. I mean REAL computer skills, not the outdated crap most people learn and think they know what's up.

[ghosthunter]

What portion of the 50%+ are even looking?

Oh, you hit that one right on the head. It's hard to look for a job when you're too busy sitting on a stoop of a dilapidated building at Broadway and Coit Streets. All day. Everyday.

[CAugust]

How many of those unemployed are seriously looking for a job?? I understand the lack of transportation can pose a problem, but didnt the immigrants have the same problem - even worse because they could not speak english?

I would hire someone based on ability and personality - not color of their skin.

Everyone thinks working at McDonalds or Burger King is beneath them, managers in those stores can make over 40k a year and then some. I assure you if you are a hard worker, it doesnt take a very long time to move up from employee to shift manager to asst manager to manager....BUT it's hard work.
When I used to hire teenagers and I saw that they worked at a fast food place for a few years, I was totally impressed with them!!!!! They knew how to work - - - those jobs are always available.

The mall is hiring for xmas help - everyone seems to be able to find transportation to Galleria Mall to shop or hang out - but to work????? hmmmm now that's a different story.

Sorry, not buying jobs are not out there..........now, maybe the type of job they dont want to do are the ones available - but not everyone is a ceo.

[Genoobie]

Wow,

I actually agree with Lefty on something...

I think Bannister's logic accounts for some of that unemployment, perhaps the percent difference b/w white and black in the city. If you look at incarceration rates, the numbers are there. Today, more than ever before, if you screw up, it's one reason for an employer not to hire you. Of course, you could say, "Well, don't screw up." But without parental guidance, or community guidance, or good lawyers, that's relatively hard for *kids* (remember everyone starts out as a kid) to do.

Sure, the transfer of wealth programs provide a disincentive to finding gainful employment, however, I'm not so sure that cutting them is the solution, because as Lefty points out, the jobs are not there. The seasonal employment market is far from an economic solution. You don't get health coverage working 20 hrs/wk at the Galleria. Same at McD's. Employers make a concerted effort no to put your health care on their rolls.

Sure, there is also sheer laziness. But people, everyone is lazy to some extent. If I had to commute 1.5 hrs each way to a $7.50 / hr job, I might be a little more than tempted to call in more often and get myself fired. However, if there were no safety net, I'd be less able to do so.

Instead, why couldn't the jobs be "community" based? There is plenty of dilapidated housing stock. Most of it is in neighborhoods where people need employment. It doesn't require much skill to tear down a house. Couldn't these people be employed at minimum wage (perhaps higher) to tear down old houses, or fix them up? Cleaning up neighborhoods? Could material be supplied and they could be paid to beautify existing residences, insulate windows, I mean there's no shortage of *real* work that needs to be done. Summer youth employment is a joke (albeit somewhat necessary). Give people meaningful work, there's plenty of it, it's just not funded or on the radar of the voting public's eye.

Of course there is a race issue, but it's less about race than it is about *class, language and behavior*. If someone shows up at an interview and "axes" a person a question, or says, "They don't have no car", you can be sure employers are going to be less likely to hire that person compared to someone who has proper diction.