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[OldTymeRevival]

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Petition drive seeks downsizing of West Seneca Town Board

Membership would be reduced to three from five

By Samantha Maziarz ChristmannNEWS STAFF REPORTER
Updated: 08/04/08 8:15 AM


Buzz up

Erie County Board of Elections officials said Friday that a petition will be enough to get a proposed reduction of the West Seneca Town Board on the ballot in November, despite objections about the legality of the procedure.

About 14 volunteers hit the streets last week, collecting more than 400 of the 1,400 signatures needed to let West Seneca residents vote whether to reduce their five-person Town Board by two members.

The idea to shrink the board was proposed by Town Supervisor Wallace Piotrowski at last Monday night’s meeting at civic activist Kevin Gaughan’s suggestion. Board members voted against the resolution.

Addressing Gaughan’s intention to collect signatures and move ahead without the board’s support, Councilman Vincent Graber said petitioning for referendum without a passed board resolution would be illegal.

Councilwoman Christina Bove supported Graber’s assertion, saying two attorneys with the Association of Towns of the State of New York had confirmed that a referendum via petition drive would be impossible without the board’s initial approval.

“This [is coming from] two attorneys who, five days a week, do nothing but answer questions for municipalities all across the State of New York,” Bove said. “I would tend to believe these two attorneys know exactly what they are talking about.”

But according to Dennis Ward, Erie County Board of Elections commissioner, the petition would be enough on its own.

The legality of the petition process is outlined in Section 81 of New York State Town Law and refers specifically to changing the size of a town board.

“It’s a very strange little section in the town law, that’s why it’s not commonly known,” Ward said. “Most people [confuse it with] ballot initiative, which we do not recognize in New York State.”

Ballot initiative is the act of putting proposed legislation directly on the ballot without involving government officials. Section 81 makes exceptions for certain circumstances, including changing the size of a town board.

Several independent attorneys confirmed Ward’s statements.

schristmann@buffnews.com

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Now, would someone tell me if Bove and Graber are just plain stupid?

PS: The old fighting Irish method: If you can't win the argument, yell louder!

[Niagara]

To:Kevin Gaughan,
Have you considered that Wallace Piotrowski might be using your initiative to disappear his opposition? Any reaction to the thought that Steve Pigeon (WNY's Karl Rove) might be guiding WP. Perhaps all board members should have to stand for reelection, and the top three win.

Also, while the petition is being circulated, might not a petition to remove tax collector also be circulated.

Thanks for your message. In every town and village that I've succeeded in rightsizing the board, the assertion that a politician who supports my plan is doing it for political purposes, or to "eliminate" oppposition has arisen (ask Mayor Bill Cansdale in Lancaster, Barb Alberti in Depwe, Tom Loughran in teh cuonty legislature, or John Mrozek in Collins). And I can tell you that this argument is always offered by those who want no change or who benefit from the status quo.

Our community and econmy are dying. As all other local institutions are doing -- from hospitals and places of worship to public libraries and private companies -- government must change to reflect our loss of population and capital. It's the necessary first step to getting our community back on its feet.

As far as I know, Mr. Pigeon opposes reform as much as Mr. Graber.

And finally, with respect to your excellent idea for eliminating the unnecessary elected position of tax collector, unlike changing the town board, state law does not permit eliminating that position through the petition process. Tax collector must be eliminated by the town board or, more likely given the looming state fiscal crisis, some day we'll see the state legislature amend the law by which "tax collector" was created, and make it a professional, un-elected position.
From,
Kevin Gaughan

This is Kevin Gaughan's reaction to the thought that there is ulterior motives involved in Wally's interest in his proposition. Also, it gives an answer to the idea of using the propositions for anything else such as the removal of tax collector, you can't. The only time the people can be directly involved in government through propositions in this state is to downsize their local government. It is easy to see how Graber and others might have been misinformed.

[Psycho1]

It is easy to see how Graber and others might have been misinformed.

If it were anyone other than Vince I might agree. However, he likes to make things up as he goes along, or interpret to fit his needs.

Case in point. I questioned the Youth Bureau Director's position and Vince told me, at the last TB meeting, it is a Civil Service position and cannot be eliminated. I checked with someone I know in County Government, who is highly involved with such an issue, and was informed the County has no record of that position as Civil Service. Second example is when I questioned Vince, along with Clark, Hicks, and Osmanski, regarding the screening between my property and Hoy Funeral Home. They all agreed Hoy was grandfathered and would not be required to install the fence. Well, if you've been past Hoy's, there is a fence, and I didn't pay for it. I proved they were all wrong with just a little homework, and no help from Billy C.

I have to wonder why Tina Bove made her statement as well. Did she in fact contact the lawyers, as she claimed, or was that just a smoke screen to save a seat on the board for her to occupy? If she did, perhaps those lawyers aren't too sharp, and gave her an answer without really knowing.

They all need to understand that the U.S. Constitution states about government, "...it is the right of the people, to alter or abolish it".

[Niagara]

I have to wonder why Tina Bove made her statement as well. Did she in fact contact the lawyers, as she claimed, or was that just a smoke screen to save a seat on the board for her to occupy? If she did, perhaps those lawyers aren't too sharp, and gave her an answer without really knowing.

If you have ever looked inside law books, or at a law library, it is a wonder anyone can find anything. DT no doubt has access to a computerized version of a law library, and it might be easier, but still you would have to know how to properly use it.

They all need to understand that the U.S. Constitution states about government, "...it is the right of the people, to alter or abolish it".

What the Constitution states and what the government will allow is always open to interpretation. The Southern states thought they retained the right to abolish their government, but Lincoln thought otherwise.
I like the idea of propositions ala California. Too bad that propositions are only allowed in NYS to downsize local government, or when your town board allows you to have one.

[Psycho1]

If you have ever looked inside law books, or at a law library, it is a wonder anyone can find anything. DT no doubt has access to a computerized version of a law library, and it might be easier, but still you would have to know how to properly use it.

And fashioned that way to insure the need for lawyers.

What the Constitution states and what the government will allow is always open to interpretation. The Southern states thought they retained the right to abolish their government, but Lincoln thought otherwise.
I like the idea of propositions ala California. Too bad that propositions are only allowed in NYS to downsize local government, or when your town board allows you to have one.

I too like the proposition idea. Just remember though, our politicians don't think we're smart enough to know how to lead our lives. In many Southern States, there are not as many layers of government as we have here. Probably explains why those places are growing.

[dtwarren]

This is Kevin Gaughan's reaction to the thought that there is ulterior motives involved in Wally's interest in his proposition. Also, it gives an answer to the idea of using the propositions for anything else such as the removal of tax collector, you can't. The only time the people can be directly involved in government through propositions in this state is to downsize their local government. It is easy to see how Graber and others might have been misinformed.

On an interesting note I have heard several stories on the relationship between Pigeon, Piotrowski and Gaughan on this issue one version that seems fairly consistent is that there was a meeting at the Liberty Building in early 2008 between none other than the three of them. I have been trying to verify this, however in doing so I noticed that among the Gaughan's "West Seneca Heros" are Al Petko and Cynthia Petko. I believe that this is the same Al Petko that ran for Town Board in 2001 against Graber and Hicks and lost. In an article by Mark Ciemcioch entitled "DEMOCRATS SET FOR MORE INFIGHTING THIS FALL" that appeared in The Buffalo News on July 31, 2000, it states: "Petko, who supports Pigeon, said he said doesn't think the Town Board is doing a very good job. . ."

[dtwarren]

Another interesting piece appeared in an article by Bob McCarthy entitled "GAUGHAN'S ANNUAL RITE OF SPRING " that appeared in The Buffalo News on April 28, 2002, it states:

It's springtime, and that means regionalism guru Kevin Gaughan must be running for office.

In springtimes of yore, the outspoken attorney has shot for Congress and mayor of Buffalo, and always in a non-traditional way. Last year, for example, Democrat Gaughan spotted a loophole in the new City Charter that said he didn't really have to live in Buffalo to run for mayor, and launched a campaign that captured significant attention. GOP leaders even thought about it for a few days, and then turned him down.

. . .

This year, The Buffalo News has learned that Gaughan is chatting with leaders of both the Republican and Democratic parties about running for county clerk. That might just send Erie County Democratic Chairman Steve Pigeon into cartwheels of ecstasy as he recruits a big name to oppose arch-nemesis Dave Swarts, the Democratic incumbent.

But interesting questions result. What does Gaughan propose to do with the bully pulpit of the clerk's office? Save the world by regionalizing the auto bureaus? Make his mark on history via real estate records?

We don't know, but the general thinking is that the clerk's office would give Gaughan just that -- a forum to spout his ideas -- similar to how Joel Giambra used his city comptroller pulpit several years ago to preach regionalism and eventually become county executive.

Gaughan isn't talking about his latest effort, but lots of others are. They wonder about the new Pigeon/Gaughan alliance, as well as where Gaughan will eventually land.

And while Republican honchoes are also dallying with Gaughan, it's a good bet Giambra's camp is none-too-amused. Relations between the county executive and clerk's office are known to be cordial (a fact Pigeon delights in exposing to the world), and the Giambra crew sees their guy as the one and only Mr. Regionalism.

Bizarre? For sure. But count on Gaughan to conduct his public life in an oh-so-non-traditional way -- especially during springtime.

Not only is Rochester billionaire Tom Golisano shaking up the political world by threatening another run for governor on the Independence line, he's really mucking up the works by talking about other lines, too.

[dtwarren]

And to round it out in an article by Michael Beebe Bob McCarthy entitled "ENDORSED JUDGES GAVE TO PIGEON" that appeared in The Buffalo News on July 28, 2002, it states:

Three of the four judicial candidates endorsed last month by Erie County Democratic Chairman G. Steven Pigeon each gave at least $1,100 to Pigeon committees in the last year, newly filed campaign expense reports showed. The fourth endorsed candidate gave the same amount in the past.

Democratic candidates who did not donate to Pigeon causes, including three sitting judges running this year, were passed over for endorsement by the Pigeon-controlled executive committee of the party.

"I don't know what to say except this is Steve Pigeon; he doesn't look at the merits of a candidate," said City Judge Margaret A. Murphy, a 10-year judge denied the endorsement. "He is the most corruptible person who's ever been the head of the Democratic Party."

"It figures with the Democratic Party and Steve Pigeon there's a price tag," said Michael A. Benson, a chief of the Erie County Sheriff's Department's court detail who is running for County Court judge.

Pigeon denied any connection between contributions and endorsements.

And he said Murphy, the only judge running for re-election to the seat she now holds, was refused the party endorsement because of her performance.

"Murphy has a very low reputation among the attorneys who appear before her," Pigeon said. "She has a lackluster reputation."

"I think Hank Nowak will make a tremendously better judge, as well as Tearah Mullins," Pigeon said of the two City Court candidates endorsed by the Democrats.

Murphy and two other Democrats who were denied Pigeon's endorsement June 3 were endorsed five days later by a party faction of 41 Democratic committee members who oppose Pigeon.

Also endorsed by the breakaway group were Thomas P. Franczyk for County Court judge and Sharon LoVallo for City Court. One candidate, John J. Aman, was endorsed by both Pigeon and the splinter group for Family Court.

The campaign expense filings were the first since a Buffalo News series this month showed that political party chairmen, especially Pigeon, closely control who runs for judge and turn judicial candidates into political fund-raisers, skirting state election law to do so.

Endorsements by Pigeon's executive committee and the party donations were made before The News series ran, but continue a pattern of contributions by judicial candidates to Democratic Party causes.

On the Republican side, one of two endorsed Republican candidates, Anne E. Adams, running for County Court, gave $450 to the Erie County Republican Committee. Kevin Carter, who was appointed to Family Court by Gov. George E. Pataki earlier this year, made no political donations.

The Pigeon endorsements came at a stormy June 3 meeting of the Democratic executive committee, in which Pigeon replaced 27 members over a rift on the endorsement for county clerk.

Judicial candidates endorsed after the dust settled were Aman for Family Court, Tearah G. Mullins and Henry J. Nowak Jr. for City Court, and Wallace C. Piotrowski for County Court.

Campaign filings show Aman gave $1,100 to the Erie County Democratic Chairman's Council in 2001 and $1,100 to the Erie County Endorsed Democrats Club in April. Nowak gave $1,100 to the endorsed Democrats in April, and Piotrowski gave $1,100 to the Chairman's Council last year when he ran for re-election as West Seneca town justice.

[Tree_hugger29]

who can take Gaughan serious when he passes rubber checks?

[dtwarren]

Now the IP is linked to Pigeon:

http://www.buffalonews.com/cityregion/story/651894.html

Independence Party lines up with Golisano
By Robert J. McCarthy NEWS POLITICAL REPORTER

G. Steven Pigeon, the former Erie County Democratic chairman, hosted a private gathering last week and invited much of the region’s political elite for a pointed message.

[OldTymeRevival]

Now the IP is linked to Pigeon:

http://www.buffalonews.com/cityregion/story/651894.html

Independence Party lines up with Golisano
By Robert J. McCarthy NEWS POLITICAL REPORTER

G. Steven Pigeon, the former Erie County Democratic chairman, hosted a private gathering last week and invited much of the region’s political elite for a pointed message.

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And that pointed message:

Here's a guy who brought the Erie County Democratic Party to its knees, divided it horribly, left it broke out of spite, and now will continue to pull stings here through the deep pockets of his political sugar daddy; and there's hardly a whimper of opposition to this fiasco. And this deal-with-the-devil will grow to monumental proportions to take back polical control here in WNY.

It sickens me, what does it do to you?

[Niagara]

Here's a guy [Pigeon] who brought the Erie County Democratic Party to its knees, divided it horribly, left it broke out of spite

I think Pigeon's only crime for the Democrats was that he did not choose candidates which won elections. It is unlikely that he tried to harm the Democratic Party, on the contrary through Golisano he directly or indirectly is still trying to help the Democratic Party, observe the big contribution to the Democratic Party Golisano gave the Democrats.

, and now will continue to pull stings here through the deep pockets of his political sugar daddy; and there's hardly a whimper of opposition to this fiasco. And this deal-with-the-devil will grow to monumental proportions to take back polical control here in WNY.

Golisano is basicly for fiscal prudence, and he loves to be in the action. He is no devil, but he wants value for his money. If Pigeon can get him into the action, and he can promote his ideas of efficient government, he is happy. For Pigeon who also loves to be in the action, Golisano gives him an avenue to also stay in the limelight. Ultimately though, Pigeon is a Democrat, and their paths separate. Democrats are not for efficient government.