Poverty

[WNYresident]

Each of those monthly ongoing bills just to survive are each made a little higher by people who steal and play the system.

[Enough]

You have to figure there are different “states” of poverty and you can’t lump everyone into the same category. So when looking at statistics you do not get the true picture of a person’s financial health.

Not withstanding our economic problems, I see a society today that is living better than any generation before us.

I’m 40, when I was a kid:
We had one TV in our house.
We had one Car in our driveway.
We had no cable TV, or Cable bill.
We had no Computer
We had no Internet, no Internet bill.
We had no Cell Phones, no Cell Phone bill.
We had no Starbucks, no $4.00 cup of Coffee.
We had no credit card, I remember my parents actually putting things on Lay-A-Way.
We played “pick up” hockey on a pond in the winter.
I hardly knew anyone that golfed.

Today:
You see a TV in every room!
You see 3-4 cars in a driveway. Drive by a high school parking lot and look at the cars the students drive.
People have HBO, Cinemax, Showtime, NFL Sunday Ticket, Center Ice Package.
People have multiple Computers.
People have Internet $$$$
EVERYONE has a cell-phone…….. Including 8 year olds!
People line up at places like Starbucks, Horton’s, etc. and leave their car run for 20 min waiting to pay for a cup of coffee.
People max out their credit cards and have nothing to show for it!
People will pay $100’s for their kid to play hockey at a place like the “Pepsi Center”.
People who can’t afford it will pay $40 a week for a round of golf.

Expenses add up quickly but perception plays a big roll too. As an overall society we are in big trouble if you are my age! My Parents generation is retired living with a pension today. My generation doesn’t have a pension, we are responsible for ourselves. Just by talking with my friends and coworkers I know a majority of them do not save enough to retire (or anything at all)!

They can’t save for the future but they:
Have new SUV’s every 2 years (leased)!
Come into work every morning with their Starbucks or Horton’s,
Order a $7 sub for lunch everyday.
Take the kids on an expensive vacation every year.
Pay for Hockey League’s for their kids (HUGE $$$$$).
Take the family to dinner to Chili’s or Applebee’s every week. Then turn around and complain about paying a babysitter to go out to dinner a 2nd night every week.
Have a $3000 flat screen TV with “Home Entertainment” package.
Own houses that consume a major portion of their monthly income. Much larger and expensive than they can afford IMO.

It goes on and on, but you get the jist. The bottom line is this…….

There are plenty of people living in poverty, no doubt. But we are in big trouble because it is going to get much worse.

The people I know today that are “living large” are going to be the same ones complaining when they are 65:
That they cannot afford to retire and need help.
That they need heating assistance.
That they need meals on wheels.
That they need medical assistance.
That taxes are too high.
That they cannot afford to live in their house.
That their bills are too high.

So the next time you see a government subsidized billboard with a senior citizen on it crying for you to donate to heat her house ask yourself:

What was she doing when she was 25?
What was she doing when she was 35?
What was she doing when she was 45?
What was she doing when she was 55?

[Aaron O'Brian]

What was she doing when she was 25?
What was she doing when she was 35?
What was she doing when she was 45?
What was she doing when she was 55?

Great post! Although life has changed during the 30 years since you were a kid, the economics hasn't. As a 33 year old soon to be dad, I've been learning what TV shows me is all false. I don't need anything but food, shelter and a vehicle to go to work. I would like to start saving more than what's in my 401k but it is so difficult to put money away, when you need a new fridge, the car needs to go to the shop or you find out your insurance doesn't cover your wife's ultra-sounds. It's maddening!!!

[Velvet Fog]

You have to figure there are different “states” of poverty and you can’t lump everyone into the same category. So when looking at statistics you do not get the true picture of a person’s financial health.

Not withstanding our economic problems, I see a society today that is living better than any generation before us.

I’m 40, when I was a kid:
We had one TV in our house.
We had one Car in our driveway.
We had no cable TV, or Cable bill.
We had no Computer
We had no Internet, no Internet bill.
We had no Cell Phones, no Cell Phone bill.
We had no Starbucks, no $4.00 cup of Coffee.
We had no credit card, I remember my parents actually putting things on Lay-A-Way.
We played “pick up” hockey on a pond in the winter.
I hardly knew anyone that golfed.

Today:
You see a TV in every room!
You see 3-4 cars in a driveway. Drive by a high school parking lot and look at the cars the students drive.
People have HBO, Cinemax, Showtime, NFL Sunday Ticket, Center Ice Package.
People have multiple Computers.
People have Internet $$$$
EVERYONE has a cell-phone…….. Including 8 year olds!
People line up at places like Starbucks, Horton’s, etc. and leave their car run for 20 min waiting to pay for a cup of coffee.
People max out their credit cards and have nothing to show for it!
People will pay $100’s for their kid to play hockey at a place like the “Pepsi Center”.
People who can’t afford it will pay $40 a week for a round of golf.

Expenses add up quickly but perception plays a big roll too. As an overall society we are in big trouble if you are my age! My Parents generation is retired living with a pension today. My generation doesn’t have a pension, we are responsible for ourselves. Just by talking with my friends and coworkers I know a majority of them do not save enough to retire (or anything at all)!

They can’t save for the future but they:
Have new SUV’s every 2 years (leased)!
Come into work every morning with their Starbucks or Horton’s,
Order a $7 sub for lunch everyday.
Take the kids on an expensive vacation every year.
Pay for Hockey League’s for their kids (HUGE $$$$$).
Take the family to dinner to Chili’s or Applebee’s every week. Then turn around and complain about paying a babysitter to go out to dinner a 2nd night every week.
Have a $3000 flat screen TV with “Home Entertainment” package.
Own houses that consume a major portion of their monthly income. Much larger and expensive than they can afford IMO.

It goes on and on, but you get the jist. The bottom line is this…….

There are plenty of people living in poverty, no doubt. But we are in big trouble because it is going to get much worse.

The people I know today that are “living large” are going to be the same ones complaining when they are 65:
That they cannot afford to retire and need help.
That they need heating assistance.
That they need meals on wheels.
That they need medical assistance.
That taxes are too high.
That they cannot afford to live in their house.
That their bills are too high.

So the next time you see a government subsidized billboard with a senior citizen on it crying for you to donate to heat her house ask yourself:

What was she doing when she was 25?
What was she doing when she was 35?
What was she doing when she was 45?
What was she doing when she was 55?

I think our government and corporations have helped our generation with a spend spend spend attitude. For me cable is my only real entertainment---I could live with that bill!

[Bannister]

We had no Cell Phones, no Cell Phone bill.

I go back and forth with myself about whether or not a cell phone is a luxury or neccessity these days. Before the days of cell phones, there used to be pay phones at every corner. I can't remember the last time I saw a pay phone anywhere. If I'm out in public and I forget my phone (which has happened on occasion) I'm at the mercy of strangers who might let me borrow their's if I ask nicely. Luckily for me, I've not been in an emergency situation without my phone.

[speaker]

It's terribly expensive for a young, or even younger family to live nowadays.

The trouble with a family with teens is the peer pressure, and I don't mean just drugs and alcohol. If you don't have brand names, all of cable tv, a computer and cell phone and all of the rest that goes with it, their friends pity them or look down on your kids.

The US has established really poor values all in the name of someone making a lot of money. I wouldn't even start to know the solution, except to start off with regaining the one worker family, remembering mom and dad are the older and wiser one of the family and cutting back when you have to, bundling all communication expenses, cutting back on driving the kids everyplace or doubling up with a neighbor and a lot more. But what you posters call the middle class, I don't. Maybe the lower middle class but very close, the way I read your posts, to the national poverty level.

Improving conditions here in America has to be done nationally, by government and by the citizens. Decide that the merchantile establishment is not going to dictate to you what your children need. Negotiate your purchases. Learn to enjoy the freebies out there with your children.

But I'm glad my children are raised cuz it was a lot of work.

[HipKat]

Holy crap.... looks like I'm on someone's ignor list.... I post the entire poverty rate of New York State and Admin is talking McD's....

Same here. I never saw any Mcy D's post....

[HipKat]

The video that was posted was about stealing from mcdonalds. People like that cause everyone else to spend more of thier money. You quoted me comment and my comment was about that video.

What do the poverty rates have to do with the comment of mine you quoted?

Oh. I never watched it.
But you're right.
I wanted to open a discussion poverty, and in less than half the time that this thread has been up, Funky's "I might be banned" thread is twice the size.

[kernwatch]

HipCat:

I share your concern.

I was angered to see the quick introduction of a video explaining how to steal fom McDonalds on a very serious thread entitled "poverty".

More posters need to 'blow the whistle' on such perversions of a major purpose of SUWNY . . to make a struggling WNY better.

Poverty . . . & Bflo's rank of Second poorest US city . . is not a joke.

[HipKat]

I go back and forth with myself about whether or not a cell phone is a luxury or neccessity these days. Before the days of cell phones, there used to be pay phones at every corner. I can't remember the last time I saw a pay phone anywhere. If I'm out in public and I forget my phone (which has happened on occasion) I'm at the mercy of strangers who might let me borrow their's if I ask nicely. Luckily for me, I've not been in an emergency situation without my phone.

I was thinking that recently, about pay-phones, because where I get on the bus, there's a payphone stand, but no phone.
And I realized, I can't remember the last tiem I saw one.
I don't even know how much one is.
As for a cell phone, my gf and I both have one, under my plan, with no house phone.

Enough was right, we are in a spend, spend economy.
But all of that is part of the cost of living.
When they started eveloping Niag. Falls. Blvd, between Sheridan and the Youngman, I noticed alot of places to spend money were being built, but no where to MAKE money.

The biggest thing is the payscale.
It has not gone up in accordance with the cost of living.
It's the same now as it was 20 yrs ago. Only minimum wage employess can sya that they've seen a big increase over that time period.

And that is where the battle line is.
However, the companies hands are tied by executives looking at the bottom line (of what goes in THEIR pockets), the cost of insuring employess has skyrocketed, especially the workman's comp rates, and the health insurance rates (which better be taken over by the Govt., because I seriously have never understood why it's up to my boss to provide my health insurance. Why not my car insurance, too??) are atrocious!

[Velvet Fog]

HipCat:

I share your concern.

I was angered to see the quick introduction of a video explaining how to steal fom McDonalds on a very serious thread entitled "poverty".

More posters need to 'blow the whistle' on such perversions of a major purpose of SUWNY . . to make a struggling WNY better.

Poverty . . . & Bflo's rank of Second poorest US city . . is not a joke.

You've actually wasted more time complaining about the Mcdonalds video than talking about poverty--your a crack pot! Whats your grand idea? How do you stop poor?

[HipKat]

Here's some telling stats:

"While in any given year 12 to 15 percent of the population is poor, over a ten-year period 40 percent experience poverty in at least one year because most poor people cycle in and out of poverty; they don't stay poor for long periods. Poverty is something that happens to the working class, not some marginal 'other' on the fringes of society."

And here's the current Poverty line in America:

Persons in Family Unit 48 Contiguous States and D.C. Alaska Hawaii
1 $10,210 $12,770 $11,750
2 $13,690 $17,120 $15,750
3 $17,170 $21,470 $19,750
4 $20,650 $25,820 $23,750 <---- Here's my household.
5 $24,130 $30,170 $27,750
6 $27,610 $34,520 $31,750
7 $31,090 $38,870 $35,750
8 $34,570 $43,220 $39,750
For each additional person, add $3,480 $4,350 $4,000


a $10.00 an hour job is 20,800 a year!!

[Enough]

I go back and forth with myself about whether or not a cell phone is a luxury or neccessity these days. Before the days of cell phones, there used to be pay phones at every corner. I can't remember the last time I saw a pay phone anywhere. If I'm out in public and I forget my phone (which has happened on occasion) I'm at the mercy of strangers who might let me borrow their's if I ask nicely. Luckily for me, I've not been in an emergency situation without my phone.

If you don't want a cell phone bill but still want a phone get a "trac phone". No monthly fee, you purchase minutes at various stores or online.

This way you have a cell phone but don't have to worry about a bill. It is also a great way to teach kids about responsibility. They can earn an allowance and buy minutes for the phone.

[steven]

You have to figure there are different “states” of poverty and you can’t lump everyone into the same category. So when looking at statistics you do not get the true picture of a person’s financial health.

Not withstanding our economic problems, I see a society today that is living better than any generation before us.

I’m 40, when I was a kid......

Very thoughtful post IMO.

The definition of poverty has been perverted in some circles. If you can afford an internet connection and a computer.... face it your not living in poverty. If you are struggling to pay your food bills and your paying for internet and computer your not poor, your foolish.

There is an expectation now that everyone should have 3 tv's, a zillion cable channels, cell phone, two vehicles etc. The old way of thinking " I will raise my kids to live a better life than me" has been twisted into "Gimmie all the goodies I can get my hands on or I must be poor"

I really see that illustrated in housing prices in buffalo. The difference between living in what some would consider the ghetto in rent money (say $250 to $300 a month) and living in a working class neighborhood (say $400 - $500 a month) is so minimal ($100 or $150) it makes one wonder why would anyone choose to live in a slum with 4 tv's and internet vs living in a better neighborhood with less material things.

We have turned into a society that craves material items to the exclusion of all else, and television and the media have taught even those that cant afford things that they must have them or they and there life are in some way wrong or bad.

[HipKat]

Very thoughtful post IMO.

The definition of poverty has been perverted in some circles. If you can afford an internet connection and a computer.... face it your not living in poverty. If you are struggling to pay your food bills and your paying for internet and computer your not poor, your foolish.

There is an expectation now that everyone should have 3 tv's, a zillion cable channels, cell phone, two vehicles etc. The old way of thinking " I will raise my kids to live a better life than me" has been twisted into "Gimmie all the goodies I can get my hands on or I must be poor"

I really see that illustrated in housing prices in buffalo. The difference between living in what some would consider the ghetto in rent money (say $250 to $300 a month) and living in a working class neighborhood (say $400 - $500 a month) is so minimal ($100 or $150) it makes one wonder why would anyone choose to live in a slum with 4 tv's and internet vs living in a better neighborhood with less material things.

We have turned into a society that craves material items to the exclusion of all else, and television and the media have taught even those that cant afford things that they must have them or they and there life are in some way wrong or bad.

Deja Vu'.

I SWEAR I've seen this same post before somewhere, from some years ago.

But to challenge the first thing you said, if you can aford a TV, would you equate thjat to not living in Poverty??
Because now-a-days, having a computer and TV is about as paramount as having a TV.

Having a cell phone is about as important as a home phone. More, because with a cell, you don't need a land line.
I have two kids, so I'll foot the expense for the cell, so I can be reached immediately, in case of an emergency.

As far as the rent thing, it's easier to get section 8, in the neighborhoods it's offered, which is primarily the lower class neighborhoods.
Plus HEAP, and everything, else qand now those toys are affordable, along with the Escalade.