McCarley Gardens and the East Side development plan

[WNYresident]

Lefty brought this up.

However, where is the spinoff? Besides consolidation, where is the growth?

The two biggest items that concern me are the status of McCarley Gardens and the East Side development plan. Both are being run by the Oak-Michigan Housing Development Corporation. Essentially, the development are for the St. John Baptist Church. The projected cost to move residents out of McCarley Gardens and construct new housing is $60M. The main component of the East Side development plan is for the build out of the High Street commercial district at $234M. That is close to $300M and it is run by a church. If you add in other elements, the cost goes up to $500M. I would like to point out the cost of CanalSide is around $300M.

I think that the redevelopment of the Fruit Belt can and should work. However, I am not sure it will happen simply because of who is behind it. Has the Oak-Michigan Housing Development Corporation completed anything, let alone something of this scale? Just what is the public oversight on this $500M project? Is it going to be similar to CanalSide?

The area known as the 'Fruit Belt' could become the gateway to the city. It 'could' anchor DT to the north, just as CanalSide 'could' anchor DT to the South. But this will only happen if both projects are done and do not break the city in the process.

What is the current housing like and what is the point of making more housing leaving the old housing vacant?

are they just moving people around so developers can profit off the move?

I found these articles.. Looks like 500 or so people.

McCarley consists of 150 units of moderate-income, HUD-subsidized housing situated on 15 acres of land adjacent to the Buffalo-Niagara Medical Campus.

Read more: http://artvoice.com/issues/v8n50/new...#ixzz13IfZFAcj

Tenants of McCarley Gardens Fight Back

http://buffalo.indymedia.org/content...ens-fight-back

UB wants medical schools downtown

http://www.allbusiness.com/society-s...2653535-1.html

Selling McCarley Gardens

http://artvoice.com/issues/v8n50/new...carley_gardens




Seeing they are moderate-income why must new housing for upwards 60 million be built? They can rent or look for a new home with their own funds.

Are these people all elderly or handicapped?

[WNYresident]

Found more

http://blogs.artvoice.com/avdaily/20...entrification/

McCarley Gardens Tenants Say No To Gentrification

Filed under: Activism,Housing,Local Interest,Local Politics — Tags: Fruit Belt, HUD, McCarley Gardens, SUNYAB, UB — Buck Quigley @ 10:36 am

Click here to download your very own postcard to mail to HUD, supporting the 150 families who would be displaced by SUNYAB’s plan to buy 14 acres of prime downtown real estate through the UB Foundation, with money donated by their alumni and others.
The group will hold a meeting at 6pm on Thursday, August 19, at the well-kept apartment complex, which was the vision of the late Burnie McCarley, former Reverend of St. John Baptist Church. He obtained the land when nobody else—including UB—believed in downtown and the Fruit Belt. Today it stands as a success story for the US Department of Housing and Urban Development.



Read more: http://blogs.artvoice.com/avdaily/20...#ixzz13Ig3ayhy

If they are of moderate income why is hud involved at all?

[WNYresident]

http://buffalo.ynn.com/content/top_s...ally/?ap=1&MP4

Tenants at McCarley Gardens hold rally

Residents of the McCarley Gardens housing complex on Michigan Ave in Buffalo rallied Thursday night against a plan to sell the complex to the University at Buffalo. Our Ryan Burgess tells us why many of these tenants are so outspoken about the plan.

BUFALO, N.Y. -- Tenants at the McCarley Gardens housing complex are concerned about the potential sale of their housing development.

"They're scared. They're scared because they've been told that it's sold. They've been told that it's going to be sold," said Gwen Walker, a member of the McCarley Garden Tenant Association.The buyer is the University at Buffalo. The $15 million dollar purchase would be part of the UB 2020 plan. Acquiring McCarley Gardens would allow the university to expand the medical corridor.
Many tenants of the development said they fear having to search for new housing as affordable as this.

If they are of moderate income why are they subsidized?

[WNYresident]

"We're here to save McCarley Gardens. This is a beautiful place. We're a community. We're like a family here and it's low, affordable housing. There's not to much of that," said Deborah Rose, a McCarley Garden Tenant Association member.

There is affordable empty housing all throughout buffalo.

Why would this project have been created in the first place?

Are these people very elderly or handicapped?

[WNYresident]

I see HUD is involved. Is this something Andrew Cuomo got us on the hook to subsidize in NYS?

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

What is the current housing like and what is the point of making more housing leaving the old housing vacant?

Are they just moving people around so developers can profit off the move?

McCarley Gardens is your basic public housing campus. Sitting on about 14 acres, you have 150 units. Or about 10 units per acre. Next to McCarley Gardens you have a parking lot. These two properties create a massive block of land that is 20 acres, bound by Goodell, Michigan, Ellicott and Elm/Virginia. To put that in perspective, the current medical campus sits on about 120 acres.

My understanding is UB wanted to put the medical school and related buildings on these 20 acres as a part of UB 20/20.

I do not see a problem with moving people as the land would be put to better use.

My biggest concern is what the replacement housing looks like. $60M for 150 units is $400k a unit!


In San Diego, they just completed a project called 1050 B Street. The building is 23 stories with 229 units (1,2 and 3 bedrooms), 124 parking spaces and is 100% affordable.

The total cost for this project was $90M.

That works out to $393,013 per unit or $6k less than the projected cost of the Buffalo project.

THIS is what Buffalo should be building in the Fruit Belt IMO. Not townhouses with lawns but nice (and the building IS NICE..see image) dense development.

The ground floor of the building is all retail and it is so close to public transportation (just like the Fruit Belt) that you do not need a car for everything.


What I fear/know is going to happen, is the Church groups doing the development are going to try and create a suburban style housing project for the residents because having a yard (at the taxpayers expense) is wanted.

[300miles]

What is the current housing like and what is the point of making more housing leaving the old housing vacant?

are they just moving people around so developers can profit off the move?

The purpose of the move isn't to leave the old houses vacant. It's to make more land available for the Medical Campus. Since it's "public" housing there are no private property issues or need for eminent domain.

As for the new housing they will build somewhere to replace it - it's possible that it's required by federal law based on whatever HUD program was used.

As for the merit of it being subsidized housing in the first place... I don't know. I'm betting it came from one of the Affordable Housing programs established over the decades, but not sure.

[WNYresident]

I think you both missed the point i'm asking. Why must new housing be built? I understand why the land would make a good fit for UB.

Why can't these people rent/reuse one of the many vacant homes in buffalo? If they are moderate income families why must other families pay for their housing?

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

I think you both missed the point i'm asking. Why must new housing be built? I understand why the land would make a good fit for UB.

Why can't these people rent/reuse one of the many vacant homes in buffalo? If they are moderate income families why must other families pay for their housing?

I think public housing has some standards and most of the vacant homes in Buffalo would not meet those standards.

Added to this, I do not think it would be wise for Buffalo to try and reuse those vacant homes for any type of public housing.

I think it is a safe bet that it would be cheaper to build new than to rehab all of those houses. To rehab a house you would most likely be looking at doing plumbing, electric, roofing, etc. It is much cheaper to work on a single site roof or do plumbing on a single building than 100s.

It also would create a management nightmare. Instead of managing a handful of complexes, you would be looking after 100s of homes.


The sad reality is that its cheaper to build new. The real issue for me is what that new construction looks like.

[joe d.]

McCarley Gardens is your basic public housing campus. Sitting on about 14 acres, you have 150 units. Or about 10 units per acre. Next to McCarley Gardens you have a parking lot. These two properties create a massive block of land that is 20 acres, bound by Goodell, Michigan, Ellicott and Elm/Virginia. To put that in perspective, the current medical campus sits on about 120 acres.

My understanding is UB wanted to put the medical school and related buildings on these 20 acres as a part of UB 20/20.

I do not see a problem with moving people as the land would be put to better use.

My biggest concern is what the replacement housing looks like. $60M for 150 units is $400k a unit!


In San Diego, they just completed a project called 1050 B Street. The building is 23 stories with 229 units (1,2 and 3 bedrooms), 124 parking spaces and is 100% affordable.

The total cost for this project was $90M.

That works out to $393,013 per unit or $6k less than the projected cost of the Buffalo project.

THIS is what Buffalo should be building in the Fruit Belt IMO. Not townhouses with lawns but nice (and the building IS NICE..see image) dense development.

The ground floor of the building is all retail and it is so close to public transportation (just like the Fruit Belt) that you do not need a car for everything.


What I fear/know is going to happen, is the Church groups doing the development are going to try and create a suburban style housing project for the residents because having a yard (at the taxpayers expense) is wanted.

PLEEEEZZZ!!! Taxpayers!!...build me a home for $393000.
I could use a new home, as I am too lazy, moderately incomed, to fend for myself...after all, this is America!!
I want it all, and I want it now!!

[WNYresident]

It also would create a management nightmare. Instead of managing a handful of complexes, you would be looking after 100s of homes.

Manage what? You mean baby sit if these are able body people? Why subsidize people for life? Worse case give them a home and end it there if you are going to spend 60 million. Let them live in a new small home and forget about. .There is nothing to manage.

I must be missing something here. The people living in this complex can't take care of themselves? Are they all handicapped? Or elderly where as they can't care for themselves?

[WNYresident]

PLEEEEZZZ!!! Taxpayers!!...build me a home for $393000.
I could use a new home, as I am too lazy, moderately incomed, to fend for myself...after all, this is America!!
I want it all, and I want it now!!

I can't find a website about the group. Anyone know what the "moderate income" level is to get a rental here?

[300miles]

I think you both missed the point i'm asking. Why must new housing be built? I understand why the land would make a good fit for UB.

I think there are a lot of rules around HUD property. I'm guessing that HUD would not approve handing the land over to UB without full replacement of all the housing units elsewhere, and ensuring that they new ones all meet minimum requirements for HUD homes.

What I fear/know is going to happen, is the Church groups doing the development are going to try and create a suburban style housing project for the residents because having a yard (at the taxpayers expense) is wanted.

Supposedly the plan was to create infill around the Fruitbelt neighborhood for their relocation, with mixes of homes and townhouses. So no it won't be a glassy highrise, but it does sound like they're trying to blend with the existing neighborhood which already is urban single-family homes. But we all know there is a very bad track record of building real "urban" styled homes.

[WNYresident]

I think there are a lot of rules around HUD property. I'm guessing that HUD would not approve handing the land over to UB without full replacement of all the housing units elsewhere, and ensuring that they new ones all meet minimum requirements for HUD homes.

Why are we taking a group of moderate income people and building them apartments that are subsidized by other people?

Are the people in the current apartments handicapped or very elderly where they need care?

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Why are we taking a group of moderate income people and building them apartments that are subsidized by other people?

Because those folks go to church on the east side and their preachers tell them who to vote for. In return, those who get elected build housing for the preachers flock.

Are the people in the current apartments handicapped or very elderly where they need care?

Mostly not.