Grocery Stores selling wine

[WNYresident]

And with the growing popularity of wine, the smaller stores will still have a niche product, because they will sell out of state and foreign wines that you won't be able to buy in grocery stores.

I would really push for wine in grocery stores if they were only allowed to sell New York wines.

If a niche is too tiny you can't run your business.

[mikenold]

I don't know where the thought that the IRS took in lots of money during Reagan's era. They didn't.

Tax receipts dropped. Deficits and inflation soared.

Where do you get your information? Obama?

After six years of economic expansion, real revenues under Reagan (with tax cuts) grew a cumulative 32.6 percent.

Link: http://www.house.gov/jec/growth/taxpol/taxpol.htm

The table below, which is based on data from the IRS’s Statistics of Income, shows what happened to tax collections from upper-income taxpayers between 1980 and 1988. Supply siders can be criticized for many things, especially their apparent disregard for the importance of limiting the size of government, but the IRS figures clearly show that lower tax rates were followed by more rich people, more taxable income, and more tax revenue. For those keeping score at home, that’s a perfect batting average for supply-side economics.


Link: http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2009/...nment-revenue/

Federal Tax revenue compared - Reagan recovery vs. Clinton/Bush recovery:



Link: http://www.house.gov/jec/growth/taxpol/taxpol.htm

Anyone with half a mind can see that not only did the Reagan tax cuts bring in more tax revenue for the FED but the cuts also caused an economic recovery like no other.

[mikenold]

Sorry for the hijack posts. There will be no more from me!

[keyboard150]

If a niche is too tiny you can't run your business.

I don't think that the niche will be too tiny.

I guess we need to look at how many people buy NYS vs other varieties.

[run4it]

With all due respect (emphasis on the word "due,) anyone who doesn't agree with me on this issue is a dummy, and should be banned from this MB.

We'll have this conversation again a year after the supermarkets start selling wine. Then, we'll see who's right.

I'll have to admit that, while I will happily sit here and argue with you on a hypothetical and theoretical level, I'd be pretty pissed if Hodge Liqour is closed in a year.

[therising]

I'll have to admit that, while I will happily sit here and argue with you on a hypothetical and theoretical level, I'd be pretty pissed if Hodge Liqour is closed in a year.

When you're in there some day buying your Ripple, and the owner tells you that he can't keep up with Wegman's wine prices, you can tell him to look at it in a macro way.

[WNYresident]

I don't think that the niche will be too tiny.

I guess we need to look at how many people buy NYS vs other varieties.

So hard liquor would still have to be purchased at a liquor store? Only wine will be available at a super market?

I would say the fee for a small liquir store would have to go away also. If you are hurting them why charge them as much for the "chance" to sell stuff.

[WNYresident]

You know this will hurt the mom and pops.

It just dawned on me something like this happened in the computer industry.

YEARS ago the only place to really get a computer was from a dealer. Then one day... apple and franklin computer company decided to sell threw computer city and child world etc... It killed off the small computer dealers because they couldn't compete. We were told sell "service" and the stuff you can't get from large retailers.. ALL i can say is BS. They just wanted to sell unit and didn't give crap. Apple would go and sell us plain computer units but at computer city you got an apple with 1000 dollars worth of "free" software... For the most part the dealers didn't get that type of offer to sell. I know wine versus computers are two different items but the theory is basically the same.

Just a money grab by NYS. What was the reasoning before hand from keeping wine out of supermarkets in the first place? WHy is that reason not good enough anymore? Just because of "money" ?

[NBuffaloResident]

You know this will hurt the mom and pops.

It just dawned on me something like this happened in the computer industry.

YEARS ago the only place to really get a computer was from a dealer. Then one day... apple and franklin computer company decided to sell threw computer city and child world etc... It killed off the small computer dealers because they couldn't compete. We were told sell "service" and the stuff you can't get from large retailers.. ALL i can say is BS. They just wanted to sell unit and didn't give crap. Apple would go and sell us plain computer units but at computer city you got an apple with 1000 dollars worth of "free" software... For the most part the dealers didn't get that type of offer to sell. I know wine versus computers are two different items but the theory is basically the same.

Just a money grab by NYS. What was the reasoning before hand from keeping wine out of supermarkets in the first place? WHy is that reason not good enough anymore? Just because of "money" ?

Well, you already admit the wine and computer business are not one and the same. The theory isn't even the same.

I agree though, the license fees for liquor stores should be dropped. It's ridiculous to be charging for a sheet of paper in a frame on a wall.

But, the original argument for keeping wine out of grocery stores was to keep the "immoral beverages" out of grocery stores. For the sake of the children.

But, nobody has answered about the side-effect of this law: How about the new crop of stores that can pop up now? Wine Specialty Stores, that can also sell things like soda and chips (Be a smash hit for a party).

Imagine, Party City getting registered as a grocer. They carry all your party supplies: Chips, Wine, Soda, Party decor, beer, and all the things to make a good party.

Or, a vendor can now open a store that deal exclusively in wine, without the costs of a liquor license. Carries every single bottle of wine you could possibly desire. All right there. All without the barrier of a liquor license.

That would be a good thing, right?

I just find it humorous, that many on this forum talk about NYS being prohibitive for business, but yet when NYS removes a barrier, people bitch and gripe about it

[WNYresident]

I just find it humorous, that many on this forum talk about NYS being prohibitive for business, but yet when NYS removes a barrier, people bitch and gripe about it

It's why it's being removed.. A money grab in the form of generating more taxes at the expense of the small mom and pop's that have been around for years. Now that they need money the past reason doesn't hold anymore? It's all BS.

If you want to open it up fairly then allow everyone to sell everything. Either way it's gonna hurt the small guy. But most don't care if they are on the receiving end or if it doesn't effect them.

Well, you already admit the wine and computer business are not one and the same. The theory isn't even the same.

It's close enough. A product that was only sold thru one group became available to all groups. It's hurt the one group because they lost that product line to people who could easily undercut them and that's what happened.

[NBuffaloResident]

It's why it's being removed.. A money grab in the form of generating more taxes at the expense of the small mom and pop's that have been around for years. Now that they need money the past reason doesn't hold anymore? It's all BS.

True, they are trying to open the markets up, so to speak, to get an increase in revenue.

It's trickle-down economics

If you want to open it up fairly then allow everyone to sell everything. Either way it's gonna hurt the small guy. But most don't care if they are on the receiving end or if it doesn't effect them.

So, you would be ok, if say, liquor stores could sell groceries? Sounds good to me. I think it's silly to have only certain stores be able to sell liquor. We're one of the few states that do that.

(Nervous Charlie's comes to mind, a Liquor/Beer/Fireworks place in Arkansas)

It's close enough. A product that was only sold thru one group became available to all groups. It's hurt the one group because they lost that product line to people who could easily undercut them and that's what happened.

The difference here is a regulated market vs a non-regulated one. The effect is not necessarily the same was my point.

[WNYresident]

Regulated or not I"m just looking at is as a product that is able to be sold.

Are they only looking at wine or all liquor in general for super markets?

Will small mom and pops be allowed to sell beer then?

[NBuffaloResident]

Regulated or not I"m just looking at is as a product that is able to be sold.

Are they only looking at wine or all liquor in general for super markets?

Will small mom and pops be allowed to sell beer then?

Just wine in grocery stores. Not liquor. Mom and pop liquor stores still have a "monopoly" on sales of liquor.

[keyboard150]

So hard liquor would still have to be purchased at a liquor store? Only wine will be available at a super market?

I would say the fee for a small liquir store would have to go away also. If you are hurting them why charge them as much for the "chance" to sell stuff.

No, I absolutely agree with you here. They would HAVE to take away the massive restrictions they place on liquor stores.

I'm arguing that yes, liquor would HAVE to be purchased at the liquor store, and any wines that aren't NYS.
Grocery stores would ONLY BE ALLOWED to sell wine from NYS wineries.

In order to make it all work, (if it would) they are going to HAVE to give something back to the liquor stores.

[Bioguy231]

You have to remember, this isn't about whether or not the state hurts somebody. It's all about the state needing money. They're already hurting a ton of people but in their minds that's OK as long as they get money. They need money to keep their special interest buddies happy so they can get tons of campaign money and get re-elected. If the liquor stores really want to convince the state not to move ahead on the wine in grocery store thingie, then the liquor stores need to organize a liquor store union and contribute a bunch of money to their state politicians. That's their only chance right now.