Greatbatch Moving

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

I wasn't actually talking about China, but fine. Right, margins. Bigger margins for primary shareholders. That's why four CEOs are moving to headquarters. Listen, I'll be the first to agree that there's waste. However, waste is not something unique to any particular business or sector. I have no idea about the company's financial portrait. There are people from Texas who say the economic picture is not so rosy there.

http://www.city-data.com/forum/buffa...l#post22642256

Could NY be more competitive and business friendly? Sure. Is there waste in NY? Sure. Are companies greedy for more dough? Sure. Are they in business to make more money to pay primary shareholders? Sure. What percentage of Greatbatch is owned by the assembly employees versus the CEOs? Hmm? To say that businesses are moving because they are not "greedy" is absurd. Margins? Call it whatever you like, it's greed. They've got a 5 year annual growth rate of 16%. Seems like they are doing alright to me (especially given the past 5 years). Their financials seem pretty decent. But yep, it's about taxes and not being biz friendly...um hmm..

Greatbatch Inc is trading at about $20.00 right now. It has a market cap of about $490M. If those employees want a say...tell them to buy some freaking stock.

It is unbelievable how people like you bitch about companies returning profits to shareholders. It's like you want to make being a shareholder some exclusive club. If those employees want a say, have them kick in 20,000 each and they would own enough of the company to have a say.

But the disingenuous part of people like you is how you bash the stock market and it's burden to shareholders yet your beloved pension is backed by the same market. When those returns are good, that you project that nobody should care about are good, your union goes to the table asking for crazy demands. When those returns are bad, you do not care because your pension is guaranteed.

Maybe if your pension/retirement was on the line with the ups and downs of the stock market, like MOST OF THE SHAREHOLDERS are, you would not come off as such a pompous tool. Digest that for a second.

[Save Us]

Greatbatch Inc is trading at about $20.00 right now. It has a market cap of about $490M. If those employees want a say...tell them to buy some freaking stock.

It is unbelievable how people like you bitch about companies returning profits to shareholders. It's like you want to make being a shareholder some exclusive club. If those employees want a say, have them kick in 20,000 each and they would own enough of the company to have a say.

But the disingenuous part of people like you is how you bash the stock market and it's burden to shareholders yet your beloved pension is backed by the same market. When those returns are good, that you project that nobody should care about are good, your union goes to the table asking for crazy demands. When those returns are bad, you do not care because your pension is guaranteed.

Maybe if your pension/retirement was on the line with the ups and downs of the stock market, like MOST OF THE SHAREHOLDERS are, you would not come off as such a pompous tool. Digest that for a second.

What I have been saying for years!! Right On Lefty!

[Genoobie]

Wow...

1) I would gladly love a greater say in how my 414H contributions are invested. I would rather invest responsibly than go for some stupid quick return scheme.

2) Market speculation is what presently drives today's market performance rather than adding real value to the economy a lot of bankers and others are just playing advanced ponzi schemes.

3) You know there are good financial planners that can take your investments out of risky vehicles and put them in guaranteed types of investments. Let me know if you need a phone number there a few people I can recommend you to. So spare me with the "I put all of my investments in risk and I am sad when they don't do well." Then change your investment strategy.

4) So you think the guy making $15 / hr assembling capacitors out in Alden has got $20K sitting in the bank? Yep, you are out of touch.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Wow...

1) I would gladly love a greater say in how my 414H contributions are invested. I would rather invest responsibly than go for some stupid quick return scheme.

2) Market speculation is what presently drives today's market performance rather than adding real value to the economy a lot of bankers and others are just playing advanced ponzi schemes.

3) You know there are good financial planners that can take your investments out of risky vehicles and put them in guaranteed types of investments. Let me know if you need a phone number there a few people I can recommend you to. So spare me with the "I put all of my investments in risk and I am sad when they don't do well." Then change your investment strategy.

4) So you think the guy making $15 / hr assembling capacitors out in Alden has got $20K sitting in the bank? Yep, you are out of touch.

If you think the guy at Greatbatch is making $15/hr...your're the one who is out of touch. You can make $15/hr at Wegmans or working at a warehouse. The people they hire in their plants are not entry level workers.

The rest of your post is worthless. Your pension, your retirement is based on the system you want to attack. The only difference is your retirement has no risk. There are people who are banking on companies like Greatbatch to make a profit so they do not have to work when they are 70. Selfish pr*ck.

[WNYresident]

4) So you think the guy making $15 / hr assembling capacitors out in Alden has got $20K sitting in the bank? Yep, you are out of touch.

What are you talking about. I know people who make 15 an hour that over time have saved more than 20k in the bank. You need to live within you means. It isn't easy.

[Genoobie]

Well I went to the Wegmans site and did a job search. Within a 50 mile radius of the 14214 zip code there were 83 jobs, but no jobs other than food prep, cashiers, etc., one for front end manager...probably doesn't pay $15/hr. But I have students who work at Wegmans, they can find out for me. Greatbatch has 25 locations and 66 job openings. Most of them seem to be highly skilled and professional opportunities so Lefty would be correct. I would love to see the employees rally and buy out major shareholders. Of course it is not that simple. Once the stock starts selling the price goes up and major shareholders become even bigger shareholders and so the little guys can't really get a say now can they. So you see there's a paradox here isn't there. There's not really a way for the employees to do what you claim is not an exclusive club.

On $15/hr you'd be pulling in about $30K per year. I'd be surprised if once you paid for food, shelter and other necessities there was much left (do-able but not likely). If you have a family that would be much harder. Suppose you wanted to save $4K / year for 5 years to earn the proverbial $20K to get significant company stock, that means you'd support yourself (plus family) on $26K?

Either way, I'm not blaming the company. It's just everybody's over the top and rabid "Dem dag-nebbit gubmint types are makin' it dag near dern impossible to do bizniz here in NY."

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Either way, I'm not blaming the company. It's just everybody's over the top and rabid "Dem dag-nebbit gubmint types are makin' it dag near dern impossible to do bizniz here in NY."

Exposed yourself to the real world rather than your sheltered existence in a classroom and then people can take your take on business climate serious.

It is almost comical that you're trying to pass off NYS as being an acceptable business environment. But once I realize what you do, where you live, what you DON'T do and where you DO NOT live...your perspective is understood.

[Genoobie]

Exposed yourself to the real world rather than your sheltered existence in a classroom and then people can take your take on business climate serious.

It is almost comical that you're trying to pass off NYS as being an acceptable business environment. But once I realize what you do, where you live, what you DON'T do and where you DO NOT live...your perspective is understood.

1) I countered your pathetic, "oh poor me I am an investor-at-risk" with the suggestion that you invest in less risky (or even guaranteed) vehicles. You didn't respond.

2) I pointed out that your claim of $15/hr jobs offered by Wegmans was BS. No response.

3) I suggested that your claim of "Well if people don't like it, they should buy up the company so they would have some say on the Board of Directors". I pointed out this was not as simple as your solution seemed to imply.

4) Since I have worked as an engineer (and somehow only people in the private sector could ever possibly ever contribute anything to the economy), I have, by your definition exposed myself to the "real world". Probably will get no response.

5) I never suggested that NY was an "acceptable business environment" but there must be some reason that NYC still remains the financial center of much of the US. There must be some reason that Greatbatch hasn't pulled out. There must be reasons that some businesses are expanding. Anyone?? Crickets and tumbleweeds...

Oh, did I forget something? Yes, Lefty you're right, does that make you feel better?

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

1) I countered your pathetic, "oh poor me I am an investor-at-risk" with the suggestion that you invest in less risky (or even guaranteed) vehicles. You didn't respond.

I called you a selfish prick. That was my response. Your pension is based on the market you despise. The only difference is you have no risk. Others do. For you do call them poor old me makes you sound like a prick. It is not all wall street types in the market...although you would like to try and make people think that.

2) I pointed out that your claim of $15/hr jobs offered by Wegmans was BS. No response.

Pharmacy Techs make $15/hr at Wegmans. Nice try guy. Know this first hand.

3) I suggested that your claim of "Well if people don't like it, they should buy up the company so they would have some say on the Board of Directors". I pointed out this was not as simple as your solution seemed to imply.

Where did I say it was simple. It's possible. That is all that matters. These people get a paycheck for work performed. That is a closed transaction. If they want more of a say..buy in.

Of course I understand it's difficult for you to understand this concept...being a union teacher and all.

4) Since I have worked as an engineer (and somehow only people in the private sector could ever possibly ever contribute anything to the economy), I have, by your definition exposed myself to the "real world". Probably will get no response.

You do not live in the real world now. Probably because you're not man enough to risk it. Took the easy job where you can fail on an ongoing result yet still keep your meal ticket. Sucks to be you.

5) I never suggested that NY was an "acceptable business environment" but there must be some reason that NYC still remains the financial center of much of the US. There must be some reason that Greatbatch hasn't pulled out. There must be reasons that some businesses are expanding. Anyone?? Crickets and tumbleweeds...

Oh, did I forget something? Yes, Lefty you're right, does that make you feel better?

NYC is not NYS. There is a difference. If you're too stupid to see that NYC has unique circumstances AND has advantages given to it by Albany at the expense of areas like Buffalo...forget about it....you are that stupid.

[Genoobie]

I called you a selfish prick. That was my response. Your pension is based on the market you despise. The only difference is you have no risk. Others do. For you do call them poor old me makes you sound like a prick. It is not all wall street types in the market...although you would like to try and make people think that.

Wow, you just don't effing get it?? Put your investment in a risk-free vehicle. People are free to do this. I already said I would prefer to manage my investment and invest responsibly rather than put it in a market that champions quick returns like bottled water. You'd flush our future down the drain for a quick return so stuff it.

Pharmacy Techs make $15/hr at Wegmans. Nice try guy. Know this first hand.

And of those 83 jobs in a 50 mile radius of 14214, how many were Pharm Techs? Yep, Wegmans is just begging to pay everyone $15/hr. Lump it.

Where did I say it was simple. It's possible. That is all that matters. These people get a paycheck for work performed. That is a closed transaction. If they want more of a say..buy in.

Of course I understand it's difficult for you to understand this concept...being a union teacher and all.

If you try to buy-in the major shareholder can manipulate the price of stock by buying and selling so that it becomes impossible for anyone else to gain control of the company. *duh?

You do not live in the real world now. Probably because you're not man enough to risk it. Took the easy job where you can fail on an ongoing result yet still keep your meal ticket. Sucks to be you.

My results are among the best in the state for my demographic. eff off.

NYC is not NYS. There is a difference. If you're too stupid to see that NYC has unique circumstances AND has advantages given to it by Albany at the expense of areas like Buffalo...forget about it....you are that stupid.

At the expense of Buffalo?? Seriously? The fact that Buffalo is even still around is because of NYC and the tax dollars they spend.

Why don't you try living in the real world?

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Wow, you just don't effing get it?? Put your investment in a risk-free vehicle. People are free to do this. I already said I would prefer to manage my investment and invest responsibly rather than put it in a market that champions quick returns like bottled water. You'd flush our future down the drain for a quick return so stuff it.

No. You do not get it. I, along with many others, invest in companies. I do not want risk free. I want returns. I am happy when a company like Greatbatch does what is best for Greatbatch.

In fact, people like you should stop crying about people losing their jobs when a company moves. If you want to avoid the risk of having your employer move on you...start your own company or STFU.

And of those 83 jobs in a 50 mile radius of 14214, how many were Pharm Techs? Yep, Wegmans is just begging to pay everyone $15/hr. Lump it.

Nice try. The fact is people are paid that amt at Wegmans. Some are paid more. Not my problem when someone is paid less. Work harder, do more in school and stop bitching about your life would be my advice to them.

If you try to buy-in the major shareholder can manipulate the price of stock by buying and selling so that it becomes impossible for anyone else to gain control of the company. *duh?

You do not need to be the major shareholder or have control of the company to change things. Google "Yahoo + Daniel Loeb + 5.8%" and get back to me when you have a clue about how the business world works.

My results are among the best in the state for my demographic. eff off.

At the expense of Buffalo?? Seriously? The fact that Buffalo is even still around is because of NYC and the tax dollars they spend.

Why don't you try living in the real world?

Still a teacher in Buffalo. Nuff said...

Lulzy on a union member in NYS telling anyone about living in the real world. Go back to your classroom son.

[wnyerlaughs]

Wow...

1) I would gladly love a greater say in how my 414H contributions are invested. I would rather invest responsibly than go for some stupid quick return scheme.

2) Market speculation is what presently drives today's market performance rather than adding real value to the economy a lot of bankers and others are just playing advanced ponzi schemes.

3) You know there are good financial planners that can take your investments out of risky vehicles and put them in guaranteed types of investments. Let me know if you need a phone number there a few people I can recommend you to. So spare me with the "I put all of my investments in risk and I am sad when they don't do well." Then change your investment strategy.

4) So you think the guy making $15 / hr assembling capacitors out in Alden has got $20K sitting in the bank? Yep, you are out of touch.

what do you really care if a pension investment doesnt do well long term? the state has already taken care of that by guaranteeing that the rest of the net taxpayers will pick up the difference. So, to that end, us NET taxpayers want the pension funds to do well, so the ydont come crawling after our net taxpyer wallets for the sake of covering any pension fund losses.

yuou'd be singing a VERY different tune if any of your public pension $$ was actually at risk of market fluctuations.

[WNYresident]

what do you really care if a pension investment doesnt do well long term? the state has already taken care of that by guaranteeing that the rest of the net taxpayers will pick up the difference. So, to that end, us NET taxpayers want the pension funds to do well, so the ydont come crawling after our net taxpyer wallets for the sake of covering any pension fund losses.

yuou'd be singing a VERY different tune if any of your public pension $$ was actually at risk of market fluctuations.

I still think they should just pay a flat sum and let the employees worry about their own retirement like everyone else does. AND if they are going to "invest" that money so that some political contributor can make money off of the investments the tax payer should be COMPLETELY out of the loop with any loss.

[Genoobie]

Maybe if your pension/retirement was on the line with the ups and downs of the stock market, like MOST OF THE SHAREHOLDERS are, you would not come off as such a pompous tool. Digest that for a second.

So then what gives? You don't mind risk but you insist that if I were somehow exposed to this, I wouldn't be a pompous tool. Make up your mind. You want returns? Then there's risk. Smaller risk = smaller return. People who boo-hoo to me about their lost savings and market fluctuations don't understand risk. They wouldn't have said a single word if they were making the magical (albeit nonsensical) returns of the 90's. I would prefer to manage my own risk and invest responsibly in a companies that are interested in more than short term gains.

So you mention Yahoo and 6% shareholder Daniel Loeb. Did he buy those shares all at once? Must have had about $1B around in excess capital as a single investor. Comparing this to GB and employees buying control of the company is ludicrous. All he did is try and align himself with some control on the board of a company that has stock valued at only half of what it was after multiple business blunders. How is this comparable to GB again?

Heh, looked into your simplistic analysis / comparison of GB and Yahoo. Turns out that at 6% Third Point (Loeb's company) *IS* a major shareholder. So now he wants a seat and he has bought himself into a position to do so. There are few other shareholders greater than him. Looked into GB's Major Shareholders. Turns out Dimensional Fund Advisors is 8% owner (making them a primary shareholder) plus another 2% or so in smaller pieces that makes them about 10% major owner. Let's see who DFA is shall we? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimensional_Fund_Advisors

Without too much digging we see that DFA is located where?? Oh right, Austin, Texas. Nope no connection! God, what an egalitarian place this market of yours is...

Finally, I don't think you understand my point. I'm not crying that GB is leaving. I'm suggesting that they are just interested in returning to their major shareholders, screw everyone else. Funny how the announcement is right on the heels of the old man's death.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

So then what gives? You don't mind risk but you insist that if I were somehow exposed to this, I wouldn't be a pompous tool. Make up your mind. You want returns? Then there's risk. Smaller risk = smaller return. People who boo-hoo to me about their lost savings and market fluctuations don't understand risk. They wouldn't have said a single word if they were making the magical (albeit nonsensical) returns of the 90's. I would prefer to manage my own risk and invest responsibly in a companies that are interested in more than short term gains.

So you mention Yahoo and 6% shareholder Daniel Loeb. Did he buy those shares all at once? Must have had about $1B around in excess capital as a single investor. Comparing this to GB and employees buying control of the company is ludicrous. All he did is try and align himself with some control on the board of a company that has stock valued at only half of what it was after multiple business blunders. How is this comparable to GB again?

Heh, looked into your simplistic analysis / comparison of GB and Yahoo. Turns out that at 6% Third Point (Loeb's company) *IS* a major shareholder. So now he wants a seat and he has bought himself into a position to do so. There are few other shareholders greater than him. Looked into GB's Major Shareholders. Turns out Dimensional Fund Advisors is 8% owner (making them a primary shareholder) plus another 2% or so in smaller pieces that makes them about 10% major owner. Let's see who DFA is shall we? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dimensional_Fund_Advisors

Without too much digging we see that DFA is located where?? Oh right, Austin, Texas. Nope no connection! God, what an egalitarian place this market of yours is...

Finally, I don't think you understand my point. I'm not crying that GB is leaving. I'm suggesting that they are just interested in returning to their major shareholders, screw everyone else. Funny how the announcement is right on the heels of the old man's death.

My gosh you're a moron. I have fun with you and all but you're kinda stupid when it comes to this stuff.