Bill's Stadium Downtown - NO WAY!

[run4it]

I like the idea of a new stadium, however I have a few concerns on the negative side.

1. Who will pay for it? I don't want the taxpayers picking up the tab (50% or greater) on a $1 billion dome stadium (current price).

Agreed. We'd have to get creative with private and public monies from all levels.

2. Buffalo Waterfront? No way. Maybe this would be a good use for Linda but now that we have momentum for developing the area into a taxable land base it would be moronically stupid. Maybe in Lackawanna near the Wind Farm because the land is probably contaminated beyond cleanup and most of it would be a capped parking lot.

If we want to bill this as a boon for Buffalo, it has to be IN Buffalo, especially if we want to give it the added value of some kind of multi-use facility.

3. Access? Where in God's name are you going to put in all the roads needed to move 65,000 - 70,000 ticket holders? The sky would have to remain and that's gotta go.

Most stadiums have traffic backups at gametime. It ain't exactly easy to get around Orchard Park on Sunday afternoons. Fans and residents deal with it. At least if it's downtown we have multiple modes of mass transportation to help out with it.

I heard "waterfront visionary" Brain Higgins along with Jim Kelly and dumb ass Antoine Thompson this morning. I'd like to know what kind crap they're smoking. Just another bag of wind by two political underachievers and a political wannabe.

Hey...I'm willing to listen to any and all ideas. What was the line? "the sun even shines on a dog's ass some days"

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

There are creative ways to finance a new stadium. New price for a State of the Art Dome is around $650 Million. The thing for Jerry in TX is abnormal.

You can sell seat licenses. This has been done in baseball and with the Carolina Panthers. This could raise $75-$150 million.

The next is guaranteed Super Bowls. These bring in north of $125 Million each. Finding a way to get that back into the coffers would be key.

The next is State funding. Several hundred million from the State is being spread out over several projects in NYC. Making sure WNY sees the same could bring in $25-$50 Million.

The next is a Dome/Convention Center like in St. Louis. This ensures the facility is used year round. By doing this, there could be a small increase in the bed tax AND a movement could be made to give all of the tax to the tourism board and paying down the stadium.

The last thing is the new owner. Jim K. mentioned on WBED he knows people who are willing to buy the team in CASH! Maybe a new owner will not be a cheap as Ralph and kick in $50-$75 Million.

[run4it]

If it's so profitable why doesn't some rich person just build one? and reap the rewards?

Because the profits and benefits go to the entire community, not just the owner of the stadium. The turnstile profits are only a part of the total economic benefit.

If we build a downtown stadium, the entire region, and especially the city, benefits from the improved neighborhoods and increased traffic/commerce. If a private entity owns, they don't get anything from the "fringe benefits," so to speak.

Basically, a stadium like this is worth far more to a community than the simple dollar figure it takes to build it, or the receipts taken at the gate.

[speaker]

Downtown stadiums are cool & exciting, we need one - but not on the waterfront. Just keep "land-banking" demolition sites and build the stadium in the inner city.

Stay healthy Ralphy, we're not ready yet!

Put it where the casino is being built---or near it I mean.

And no, Time Warner seems to think that football is all Buffalo thinks about. Raise the standards, TW. And res, there are other happenings at the stadium, such as the marching bands.

Buffalo needs an awful lot of stuff. So why another stadium? Without a shell, at that.

Achbek- glad you're not the town planner.

[mesue]

A stadium downtown? That would be cool. Especially a domed stadium. the closer to the waterfront the better.
Monday Night Football loves to show the night scape by water. I'm reminded of Three River Stadium in Pittsburgh, it looks so nice with the light twinkling off the water.

[Velvet Fog]

First of all, I don't believe that Buffalo needs the Bills at all.

That being said, why would we need a downtown stadium. After all, what have these downtown stadiums done for Cleveland, Detroit, Chicago, and the rest.

It brings people downtown that would normally not be downtown. It would make a huge difference---at least on a ballgame week.

You can't find a hotel room in downtown Cleveland when a baseball or football game is going on.

[CSense]

Put it where the casino is being built---or near it I mean.

I would go for that site. You could tie in a hotel and other amenities (restaurants, espn zone, etc) with HSBC Arena, the casino.

It's near the Waterfront, so the blimp could get the Water and the skyline.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

As far as other uses....


High School Football is not a big enough draw in WNY. This is mostly due to the stupid rules of Section 6 and not to do with the talent in the area. HS teams would need to have the ability to play more then 8 regular season games and have room to draw regional and national match ups.

ECC could use the stadium. The football program is doing great things. They are a great feeder program for kids who do not get noticed during HS and several are getting full rides to schools after playing a year or two.

In the spring, it could be used on the weekend for all day soccer and LAX tournaments. This is of course if Section 6 moves soccer to the spring.

Concerts could be done during all year since it would not be effected by the weather.

[Trolls_r_us]

I like the idea of a convention center/stadium combo

plus with a dome people will be more likely to attend late season games if the team isn't great.....

I don't like a dome from a football perspective, but a multi-use facility needs to be domed, and it could lead us to host a Super Bowl.

Between Niagara Falls, Buffalo, Fort Erie, and Rochester there are PLENTY of hotel rooms to host a bowl.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

Between Niagara Falls, Buffalo, Fort Erie, and Rochester there are PLENTY of hotel rooms to host a bowl.

Not really sure about this. I do not think the NFL considers hotels in Fort Erie or Rochester as rooms for a Super Bowl. That is a little far if you ask me.

Niagara Falls and Buffalo is pretty much where you have to count rooms from.

Someone correct me if I am wrong but I remember reading somewhere that even if we get a massive convention center, there would not be enough hotel rooms in the area to host a convention on that scale.



Way out of the box but maybe on top of the Dome AND Convention Center, there was a Hotel added to the complex. It could be run by a big company but the bed tax for just that single hotel would go to the cost of the complex.

They could run ticket and room packages for people from Toronto and Rochester during games. They could also run convention and room specials during conventions.

I have mentioned many times private Convention Center companies like Gaylord Ent. who uses this model of an "all in one" to cover there cost.

[CSense]

Someone correct me if I am wrong but I remember reading somewhere that even if we get a massive convention center, there would not be enough hotel rooms in the area to host a convention on that scale.

You are correct. The city had a major convention here once (Bennett Smith's Ministry) and all the hotel and motel space in the city and suburbs couldn't hold all the visitors.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

I like the idea of a new stadium, however I have a few concerns on the negative side.

1. Who will pay for it? I don't want the taxpayers picking up the tab (50% or greater) on a $1 billion dome stadium (current price).

There are creative ways to finance a stadium that does not come from sticking the bill on the back of taxpayers. You simply need creative people in Government...something WNY has not had in 50 years.
One also has to wonder what the land value of the current stadium in OP is.


2. Buffalo Waterfront? No way. Maybe this would be a good use for Linda but now that we have momentum for developing the area into a taxable land base it would be moronically stupid. Maybe in Lackawanna near the Wind Farm because the land is probably contaminated beyond cleanup and most of it would be a capped parking lot.

Putting it any other place then smack dab on the water is silly. A perfect location would be around S. Park Ave in the 1st ward. Maybe on the Ohio Basin site or where the Perry Projects used to be located. If it does not go on the water it should not be moved is my opinion.

3. Access? Where in God's name are you going to put in all the roads needed to move 65,000 - 70,000 ticket holders? The sky would have to remain and that's gotta go.

If it went on the sites I mentioned above, you have the 190 within walking distance AND there is a proposal to expand the Metro into a loop in the 1st ward. Really if you stand back for a second, you can see it all coming together. The ONLY challenge in my eyes is the money. It is a huge challenge but there is really nothing else outside of that.

I heard "waterfront visionary" Brain Higgins along with Jim Kelly and dumb ass Antoine Thompson this morning. I'd like to know what kind crap they're smoking. Just another bag of wind by two political underachievers and a political wannabe.

Say what you want about Brian and Antoine but the comments on Jim are out of line. This is a PA guy who is Buffalo to the bone.

[CSense]

Say what you want about Brian and Antoine but the comments on Jim are out of line. This is a PA guy who is Buffalo to the bone.

Like I said in my opening line, I'm for the idea of a new stadium. I think it the Old First Ward is a perfect fit but not Buffalo's Waterfront. I think we both agree, from previous threads, that the waterfront has the potential for some exciting development which will develop our tax base. Something the city so desperately needs.

You're right, it's going to be all about the money. Higgins and do nothing Thompson are going to look for government handouts. This is the wrong thing to do. The only way this community will go for it will be through creative financing, except for morons like Thompson.

As for my comments on Jimbo, I don't think I really called him anything more than a political wannabe. He was and still maybe interested to run for Higgin's seat. I understand his standing within the community and like him for his passionate love for Buffalo, that said I don't feel it was a harsh statement.

[Linda_D]

I like the idea of a new stadium, however I have a few concerns on the negative side.

1. Who will pay for it? I don't want the taxpayers picking up the tab (50% or greater) on a $1 billion dome stadium (current price).

2. Buffalo Waterfront? No way. Maybe this would be a good use for Linda but now that we have momentum for developing the area into a taxable land base it would be moronically stupid. Maybe in Lackawanna near the Wind Farm because the land is probably contaminated beyond cleanup and most of it would be a capped parking lot.

3. Access? Where in God's name are you going to put in all the roads needed to move 65,000 - 70,000 ticket holders? The sky would have to remain and that's gotta go.

I heard "waterfront visionary" Brain Higgins along with Jim Kelly and dumb ass Antoine Thompson this morning. I'd like to know what kind crap they're smoking. Just another bag of wind by two political underachievers and a political wannabe.

Excuse me, but I think the stadium is good where it is. The waterfront is the last place to build a stadium, domed or not. It already takes 2 hours to get out of the lots now!

[wnyfuture]

Plus it's only 8 or less home games. Basically is sits empty 40 or more weeks, correct?

Pittsburgh does this for the Steelers and Panthers (U of Pitt)

They use the stadium for both the college and steelers, more use, more money. UB already wants to come downtown, why not bring the football team? Knock down the current UB Football stadium, put in more parking and housing for the students.

This would be the only way I would want a downtown stadium, now that we would lose 2 games to Toronto, not a easy sell for a new stadium. You would need a second tenant.

You could build a football stadium downtown attached with a new convention center and on the waterfront, you build a outdoor amphitheatre. Cleveland put one right on the water or just like this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hollywood_Bowl