Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group - 3rd Meeting

[Willvillstudy]

The Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group, composed of all volunteers whose only concern is how much we pay and what we get in the village and how much we can save and what will still have if the village is dissolved held our third community meeting yesterday.

At the meeting we discussed our most recent report. Here is what we know:

Village residents are not double taxed by the Village and Town.
Village residents pay a Village tax for services supplied by the Village and a part Town tax for services supplied by the Town.
Village residents do not pay special district taxes like Town residents.
Village residents pay on average $170 more per year than Town residents.
The largest Village expenses are sewer, water and garbage.
The salary of Village Trustees and the Mayor are .4% of the budget.

If the Village is dissolved...

Village assets including: Village Hall, The Mill, The Historic Meeting House, DPW Buildings would be sold to the Town or a third party.
Village debt will be paid by Village taxpayers.
The Town Community Plan, Zoning Board and Building Code would determine village character and plans for future development.
Village Committees would not continue.
Representation would go from 1 representative in 1000 residents to 1 resident for every 17,000 residents.
Sidewalk plowing would be discontinued and residents would be responsible for snow removal on sidewalks in front of their homes.
Village parks would become Town parks.
The garbage contract would remain the same, but refuse “pick up services” for metal and leaves would change.
Sewer Services would continue.
Water service would be turned over to the Erie County Water Authority.
Storm drainage service would remain unchanged.
Fire protection would continue.
Police protection would be provided as before.
Village residents would not save the entire Village tax bill, since a majority goes to pay for sewers, water, garbage, roads, plowing and fire protection.

Based on structured interviews with village and town elected officials, since it is the village board that would write the dissolution plan, the Town Supervisor who would negotiate details on behalf of the town and the Town Board who would approve aspects of the plan that effect the town. After analyzing and triangulating the data in search of consistencies and inconsistencies in responses we think:

The Village has two choices for properties and assets: Sell them to the Town or sell them to a third party. In either case, the Village would not get full market value for the properties. The sale of properties to the Town could reduce the debt to be paid by Village residents.
Village residents would pay Village debts until retired. The Town would not ask Amherst taxpayers to pay past village debts or debts for sewer and water infrastructure necessary to dissolve the Village.
The Village Code would expire within 2 years of dissolution. The Town of Amherst Community Plan, Zoning Board and Building Code would not adequately address future development in the Village.
Fire protection would remain unchanged. The Town would create a fire district consistent with the current area covered.
The 5 Village parks would not be sold without permission from the State of New York. Village parks would become town parks. There are currently more than 30 Town parks that compete for resources and improvements based on need and financial resources. Capital improvements to parks would be diminished due to increased competition for resources with Town parks.
Sewer service would continue either under the Town as a special district or through a Sewer District encompassing Amherst, Clarence and the Village of Williamsville, if negotiations are successful.
The Erie County Water Authority would take over the Village water system. Rates for water would decrease, but capital improvements would be needed. In dissolution, the Village’s negotiating power would be diminished and capital improvements to the system would be determined by ECWA. The cost for improvements would be paid by Village residents.
Snow plowing in the village may be less responsive. The Village snow plowing routes complete snow removal in 6 hours. The Town snow plowing routes complete snow removal in 8 hours.
Village residents would not see significant tax savings through dissolution since specials districts would be created and current debt would remain with village taxpayers. The tax savings from dissolving the Village would be determined by the profits from the sale of assets, the elimination of services and the jobs that go with them.

As always, we want an open, honest public conversation on the facts so informed residents can make a decision on the form of their government based on the services provided and the cost.

To read the full report check out our web site - www.willvillstudy.com

Chris
Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group

[Add It Up]

The Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group, composed of all volunteers whose only concern is how much we pay and what we get in the village and how much we can save and what will still have if the village is dissolved held our third community meeting yesterday.

At the meeting we discussed our most recent report. Here is what we know:

Village residents are not double taxed by the Village and Town.
Village residents pay a Village tax for services supplied by the Village and a part Town tax for services supplied by the Town.
Village residents do not pay special district taxes like Town residents.
Village residents pay on average $170 more per year than Town residents.
The largest Village expenses are sewer, water and garbage.
The salary of Village Trustees and the Mayor are .4% of the budget.

If the Village is dissolved...

Village assets including: Village Hall, The Mill, The Historic Meeting House, DPW Buildings would be sold to the Town or a third party.
Village debt will be paid by Village taxpayers.
The Town Community Plan, Zoning Board and Building Code would determine village character and plans for future development.
Village Committees would not continue.
Representation would go from 1 representative in 1000 residents to 1 resident for every 17,000 residents.
Sidewalk plowing would be discontinued and residents would be responsible for snow removal on sidewalks in front of their homes.
Village parks would become Town parks.
The garbage contract would remain the same, but refuse “pick up services” for metal and leaves would change.
Sewer Services would continue.
Water service would be turned over to the Erie County Water Authority.
Storm drainage service would remain unchanged.
Fire protection would continue.
Police protection would be provided as before.
Village residents would not save the entire Village tax bill, since a majority goes to pay for sewers, water, garbage, roads, plowing and fire protection.

Based on structured interviews with village and town elected officials, since it is the village board that would write the dissolution plan, the Town Supervisor who would negotiate details on behalf of the town and the Town Board who would approve aspects of the plan that effect the town. After analyzing and triangulating the data in search of consistencies and inconsistencies in responses we think:

The Village has two choices for properties and assets: Sell them to the Town or sell them to a third party. In either case, the Village would not get full market value for the properties. The sale of properties to the Town could reduce the debt to be paid by Village residents.
Village residents would pay Village debts until retired. The Town would not ask Amherst taxpayers to pay past village debts or debts for sewer and water infrastructure necessary to dissolve the Village.
The Village Code would expire within 2 years of dissolution. The Town of Amherst Community Plan, Zoning Board and Building Code would not adequately address future development in the Village.
Fire protection would remain unchanged. The Town would create a fire district consistent with the current area covered.
The 5 Village parks would not be sold without permission from the State of New York. Village parks would become town parks. There are currently more than 30 Town parks that compete for resources and improvements based on need and financial resources. Capital improvements to parks would be diminished due to increased competition for resources with Town parks.
Sewer service would continue either under the Town as a special district or through a Sewer District encompassing Amherst, Clarence and the Village of Williamsville, if negotiations are successful.
The Erie County Water Authority would take over the Village water system. Rates for water would decrease, but capital improvements would be needed. In dissolution, the Village’s negotiating power would be diminished and capital improvements to the system would be determined by ECWA. The cost for improvements would be paid by Village residents.
Snow plowing in the village may be less responsive. The Village snow plowing routes complete snow removal in 6 hours. The Town snow plowing routes complete snow removal in 8 hours.
Village residents would not see significant tax savings through dissolution since specials districts would be created and current debt would remain with village taxpayers. The tax savings from dissolving the Village would be determined by the profits from the sale of assets, the elimination of services and the jobs that go with them.

As always, we want an open, honest public conversation on the facts so informed residents can make a decision on the form of their government based on the services provided and the cost.

To read the full report check out our web site - www.willvillstudy.com

Chris
Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group

I believe you mean "Zoning Code," not Zoning Board above.

Also, people in the village need to understand that the Town votes June 15th on whether to downsize the Town Board by 2 representatives, meaning that the ratio of representatives to residents will be more like 1 representative for approximately 25,000 residents. Our representation will be even less if you consider the Supervisor acts more as an administrator than a representative of the people. More power will be given to this Supervisor if the other referendum passes at the June election also.

Why would it be the Town Supervisor who would negotiate "deals" for the consolidation of the Town and village, and not a negotiation team set up by the Town Board?

Also keep in mind that the sewer consolidations now being negotiated in the backroom will give local governments (i.e. the Town or village) even less say in where infrastructure improvements, and thus development, will go. The Comprehensive Plan in Amherst has already been effectively halted in lieu of backroom committees and "friendly" deals. The Comprehensive Plan will evaporate before your eyes. Don't think it will protect anything about Williamsville.

And doesn't the Town already own the land the Village Hall sits on?

[Trajan]

The Comprehensive Plan will evaporate before your eyes. Don't think it will protect anything about Williamsville.

The Comprehensive Plan HAS evaporated before our eyes. We, the taxpayers paid thousands for its creation--some say $750,000-to one million. It has proven to be a monumental squandering of money, time and goodwill among the people. It was supposed to protect our residents' quality of life and our Town from willy-nilly, spot-zoning and rezoning. Seems like the motto for Amherst is: "Rules and laws are made to be broken."
Williamsville be warned.

[mikenold]

The Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group, composed of all volunteers whose only concern is how much we pay and what we get in the village and how much we can save and what will still have if the village is dissolved held our third community meeting yesterday.

At the meeting we discussed our most recent report. Here is what we know:

Village residents are not double taxed by the Village and Town.
Village residents pay a Village tax for services supplied by the Village and a part Town tax for services supplied by the Town.
Village residents do not pay special district taxes like Town residents.
Village residents pay on average $170 more per year than Town residents.
The largest Village expenses are sewer, water and garbage.
The salary of Village Trustees and the Mayor are .4% of the budget.

To read the full report check out our web site - www.willvillstudy.com

Chris
Village of Williamsville Citizen Study Group

It seems to me that if a typical village resident would have a savings of 170.00 per year, there is no reason not to dissolve. That's about 14.00 per month. Of course the real savings could be even more once the debt payoff period is over. I don't live there so I can't say what the residents would do but to me, if I save any money at all by dissolving the village it is worth the trouble. Next, you work on the Town to get the tax lowered.

[cookie]

It seems to me that if a typical village resident would have a savings of 170.00 per year, there is no reason not to dissolve. That's about 14.00 per month. Of course the real savings could be even more once the debt payoff period is over. I don't live there so I can't say what the residents would do but to me, if I save any money at all by dissolving the village it is worth the trouble. Next, you work on the Town to get the tax lowered.

Not everyone will save that amount. I don't know what the going rate is for shoveling sidewalks, but those that can't do it for themselves could conceivably spend that much to keep them snow-free? You're young and look to be in good health, so you would save. Everyone's mileage differs

[Willvillstudy]

It seems to me that if a typical village resident would have a savings of 170.00 per year, there is no reason not to dissolve. That's about 14.00 per month. Of course the real savings could be even more once the debt payoff period is over. I don't live there so I can't say what the residents would do but to me, if I save any money at all by dissolving the village it is worth the trouble. Next, you work on the Town to get the tax lowered.

No question...there should be savings from dissolving the village at some point, but the amount of savings is not related to the $170 on average village residents pay more than town residents.

We respect anyone who makes their decision based cost and the promise of real savings (even pennies), we just want to make sure that those savings are actually going to be there and are not just baseless political propaganda.

It will be only if an actual plan for dissolving was drawn up (if people so choose) and approved by the village and town that residents could calculate how much they will save and when. We have tried to get as close as possible through our analysis and structured interviews to an answer with out the actual plan being drawn up before a vote.

We know that through the sale of assets, the elimination of services and jobs (including pensions and health insurance for some employees) along with the amount of debt to be retired from the sale of assets (the mill, dpw, village hall, meeting house and then equipment and fixtures and such) the actual savings to village residents can be calculated.

Tax savings will depend on how much the village gets for assets, how many village employees become town employees and how the town chooses to structure taxes for village residents.

We know that there is no way that village residents could pocket the toal amount of their village tax bill by shifting services to the town, since necessary services will still be provided (i.e. sewer, water, roads, plowing, drainage, fire protection) and village residents would pay the town for those services. Village tax bill gone = Town tax bill and special district taxes go up.

So, the real tax savings year over year will be calculated by determing the amount of debt owed by the village and the amount the town charges through town tax and special districts and comparing it to previous years.

A very true point is that with no village no more debt can be issued and when it is paid off it is paid off. That being said, the town will then issue debt for capital improvements and who will pay for it?

We continue to thoroughly search for better answers to complex questions so we can be as informed as possible. At the end of the day all we want to know is what we are getting out of this deal.

Chris

[hate politics]

Chris -

Some of my friends who live in the village are growing skeptical of your study and findings as they have heard that the Mayor was at the last study meeting claiming that she had some part in the study (some people have heard that she proclaimed it her village board study). Did she and/or the village board financially support the study?

My question is: are you really a separate grass root organization or a front for village politicians, namely the Mayor?

On one hand, I don't have a dog in this fight as I am a town resident but I do know my village friends are now confused and are questioning your motivations. If the village board and mayor have nothing to do with the study and are trying to grab some headlines, you might want to correct that because my village friends are growing concerned.

[Willvillstudy]

And doesn't the Town already own the land the Village Hall sits on?

The town owns town hall and the library...the village owns the land and building on which village hall and the fire department sit.

Chris

[Willvillstudy]

Chris -

Some of my friends who live in the village are growing skeptical of your study and findings as they have heard that the Mayor was at the last study meeting claiming that she had some part in the study (some people have heard that she proclaimed it her village board study). Did she and/or the village board financially support the study?

My question is: are you really a separate grass root organization or a front for village politicians, namely the Mayor?

On one hand, I don't have a dog in this fight as I am a town resident but I do know my village friends are now confused and are questioning your motivations. If the village board and mayor have nothing to do with the study and are trying to grab some headlines, you might want to correct that because my village friends are growing concerned.

I am happy to answer that question. The source of information is always worth examining and I appreciate the way you ask the question without accusation.

We are not affiliated, a front, connected, funded, attached, conspiring with, helping, protecting the mayor or any other politician or political group.

When our group of residents began meeting I stated clearly to those who were willing to help that anyone who took a public position was not welcome to be part of our group. Those who have taken a position were dismissed from the group.

Our mission remains the same: seek factual information so that we as residents can make an informed decision. Our goal remains the same: find out how much we pay and what we get and compare that to how much we can save and what we will have.

To date I have spent close to $1000 out of my own pocket for the expenses related to this endeavor. I have not and will not be reimbursed. We will not hold a fundraiser.

I was very upset that the Mayor showed up at our meeting and had the audacity to sit in the front row and then speak to the Buffalo News afterwards. I was extremely vocal, overheard by many after the meeting denouncing the Mayor who has had no role in our study beyond answering the questions, we as citizens have demanded she answer. I will contact the Mayor in the near future, to express my displeasure, I did not do it already because I am still angry and everything we are trying to do pivots on the hope that we can have a civil conversation based on facts.

One final point. I spent 5 years working in politics for the Erie County Legislature - both the democratic and republican caucuses. I despise politics and will not be running for office after this matter is settled.

Thank you for asking the question. I hope you will share the information with those who have questions. Tell them to feel free to email us through the web site or give me a call.

Thanks,
Chris