View Poll Results: Will grocery stores selling wine put liquor and wine stores out of business?

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  • Yes

    10 43.48%
  • No

    11 47.83%
  • I don't know

    2 8.70%
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Thread: Grocery Stores selling wine

  1. #16
    Member leftWNYbecauseofBS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by therising View Post
    Te whole "they do it in other States and it seems to work fine" reaction is short-sighted.

    Here's why it's wrong to allow supermarkets to sell wine in NYS:

    Liquor stores are very heavily regulated - they're permitted to sell only very specific items. They can not sell things such as cigarettes, candy. I don't even think they're allowed to sell ice.

    They can not even open more than one store under their own name.

    Knowing what they're getting into, the operators open, pay for licenses, and do so with the knowledge that, even though they're prohibited from selling most items, in return the State allows them to sell items (i.e. liquor and wine,) that no one else is allowed to sell.

    So, for the State to now say "even though we've been regulating what you're selling all these years, we now need to raise money for the State, so we're going to remove wine from the equation and let supermarkets sell it," is purely unfair.

    Basically the State is saying "thanks for paying those fees all those years, but, **** you, because we're breaking our end of the deal."

    And, it will kill many liquor stores, all which are mom and pop operations.

    Two sides to the coin.

    One could also look at it as liquor stores paid a fee all of these years to have exclusive rights to sell liquor.

    You appear to have a deeper understanding of the regulations, but from my perspective, if it is a yearly fee, then it is something that can expire at anytime. No?

    Furthermore, correct me if I am wrong, but if Grocery stores are able to sell wine and liquor with food, ice and smokes, wouldn't that open the doors for liquor stores to offer food, ice and smokes with their current inventor of wine and liquor?

  2. #17
    Member mikenold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS View Post
    Two sides to the coin.

    One could also look at it as liquor stores paid a fee all of these years to have exclusive rights to sell liquor.

    You appear to have a deeper understanding of the regulations, but from my perspective, if it is a yearly fee, then it is something that can expire at anytime. No?

    Furthermore, correct me if I am wrong, but if Grocery stores are able to sell wine and liquor with food, ice and smokes, wouldn't that open the doors for liquor stores to offer food, ice and smokes with their current inventor of wine and liquor?
    The grocery stores will not be selling Liquor only wine.
    **free is a trademark of the current U.S. government.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bioguy231 View Post
    I hope everyone realizes that what is really going on here is the NYS needs money! Our NYS legislators don't care where we buy wine or who sells wine. If they can pass legislation allowing grocery stores to sell wine they can charge a hefty license fee to those stores. Last year they raised taxes and fees and created new fees but, they still need more money!!!
    Exactly. If NYS proposes raising taxes that affect us all, everyone gets angry over it.
    But, in this case - it's only going to hurt a small segment, so a lot of people are all for it.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS View Post
    Furthermore, correct me if I am wrong, but if Grocery stores are able to sell wine and liquor with food, ice and smokes, wouldn't that open the doors for liquor stores to offer food, ice and smokes with their current inventor of wine and liquor?
    I don't think there's anything on the table that would open up what liquor stores can sell.
    But even if there was - keep in mind that most liquor stores are small mom and pop operations that set up their stores, specifically based on the product they were allowed to sell. If they were suddenly allowed to sell food, they'd really become nothing more than a convenience store with liquor.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikenold View Post
    The grocery stores will not be selling Liquor only wine.
    So, that's "only" half their profit.

  6. #21
    Member run4it's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by therising View Post
    Exactly. If NYS proposes raising taxes that affect us all, everyone gets angry over it.
    But, in this case - it's only going to hurt a small segment, so a lot of people are all for it.
    A) they're not raising taxes...just the group of people who are eligible to pay those taxes.

    B) If consumption does increase (as expected) it means more money for makes, distribution outlets, etc. Can you show that it won't basically offset?
    But your being a dick
    ~Wnyresident

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by run4it View Post
    A) they're not raising taxes...just the group of people who are eligible to pay those taxes.
    I know. That was my point.

    Quote Originally Posted by run4it View Post

    B) If consumption does increase (as expected) it means more money for makes, distribution outlets, etc. Can you show that it won't basically offset?
    Whether or not people drink more, allowing the State to make more money is not my concern.

    I thought I was clear in expressing my reasons for arguing against this. But from the questions you're asking me, I'm beginning that it's not the case.

  8. #23
    Member run4it's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by therising View Post
    I know. That was my point.



    Whether or not people drink more, allowing the State to make more money is not my concern.

    I thought I was clear in expressing my reasons for arguing against this. But from the questions you're asking me, I'm beginning that it's not the case.
    From what I understand (and giving you the benefit that you're smarter than me) I'm getting you're concerned about the small liquor store owners. My point is that, even if some of them close up, there will be increased opportunity in related fields, such as production and logistics. In my macro view of the market, would they not offset?
    But your being a dick
    ~Wnyresident

  9. #24
    Member sharky's Avatar
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    completely out of business no
    but it might put some out

    but then there will be ones that specialize in wider variety than what the grocery stores carry. kind of like what consumer's beverage does with beer
    Vote for freedom, not political parties.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by run4it View Post
    From what I understand (and giving you the benefit that you're smarter than me) I'm getting you're concerned about the small liquor store owners. My point is that, even if some of them close up, there will be increased opportunity in related fields, such as production and logistics. In my macro view of the market, would they not offset?
    First of all, you're much smarter. Irregardless (proving my point), I don't give a damn about production, logistics, and your macro view of the market.

    My only concern is for the poor schleps who own liquor stores, and are in jeopardy of losing a good deal of their profits, simply because NYS needs more money.

  11. #26
    Tony Fracasso - Admin
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    therising
    My only concern is for the poor schleps who own liquor stores, and are in jeopardy of losing a good deal of their profits, simply because NYS needs more money.
    You see it... I see it... but most don't care because it won't effect them at all.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by WNYresident View Post
    You see it... I see it... but most don't care because it won't effect them at all.
    I'm from California and you can find wine and spirits everywhere -- grocery stores, drug stores, mini-marts etc.

    You see a lot of liquor in those places. What you see very little of are actual liquor stores. There is simply no way they can compete with the big guys. You can buy a perfectly lovely bottle of red California wine for about $2 at Trader Joe's. No way a Mom and Pop operation can compete with that.

    Frankly, I'd rather give my business to a Mom and Pop wine/spirits store. Grocery stores like Wegmans already get plenty of my business. I'd rather pay more at local wine/spirits store and know I'm keeping a neighbor in business.

    It's bad enough that so many of us have been put out of jobs due to foreign competition. I hate it when we put each other out of business.

  13. #28
    Tony Fracasso - Admin
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    Total sees it also. THe problem we have is there will be people on the receiving end of those taxes. They don't care as long as they get something out of it. Just look at the attitude of people on speakup in some cases. BUSINESS owners are rich, they are evil, blau blau blau... if it wasn't for business owners there wouldn't be jobs or any government because GOVERNMENT doesn't make money. Businesses do.

  14. #29
    Member NBuffaloResident's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WNYresident View Post
    Total sees it also. THe problem we have is there will be people on the receiving end of those taxes. They don't care as long as they get something out of it. Just look at the attitude of people on speakup in some cases. BUSINESS owners are rich, they are evil, blau blau blau... if it wasn't for business owners there wouldn't be jobs or any government because GOVERNMENT doesn't make money. Businesses do.
    Wait, aren't you the one who says politicians should screw everyone else, in favor of yourself?
    Raptor Jesus: He went extinct for your sins.

  15. #30
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    New Hampshire owns its liquor stores and uses that as a way to put some money in the state coffers.

    Grocery stores do sell wine.

    Maybe NYS could figure in a similar plan. With a regulation stating that grocery stores can only sell NYS wine.

    I think that is a reasonable compromise?
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