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Thread: Changes with Amherst golf courses

  1. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by WNYresident View Post
    This is why IDA's need to be abolished.
    IDA's don't need to be abolished. They just need to be run better and I think they need to have a shift on what they focus on.

    Keeping on the topic of Amherst, the IDA help build the town into a powerhouse. There is no denying it's success for the town residents. If you're outside of Amherst..that's another story.

    That said, they need to change their focus from getting new development going to providing incentives for existing owners to invest back into their properties. For example, the Boulevard Mall is owned by Forest City Development. They have experience in EVERY kind of development from housing to mixed us to lifestyle centers.

    Now this Mall is on the way out but that does not mean it can't come back. Just imagine that instead of a sea of parking lots fronting NF Blvd, Maple and Alberta there was mid-rise residential with attached parking. For the mall itself, now that it would be surrounded by housing, you could attract a different type of tenant. Instead of just retail it could have everything from gyms to places to eat.

    Now is something like this feasible in Amherst? Who knows. There might not be a demand for it. That said, I think it's reasonable to explore. I think it's reasonable for the IDA to try and push a multi-point project like this rather than just working on the next office park.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS View Post
    Redevelopment means upgrading existing developed areas. An example of this is what is happening at the Northtown Plaza with Whole Foods. New development would be building a new plaza on land that's currently empty.

    There are so many areas of Amherst showing age, while at the same time, Amherst is running out of large parcels to develop. When you look at that fact and the reality that Amherst is a great town, not putting hundreds of acres of land out to development is one way to help redevelop and reinvest in the existing parcels.
    Haha. I assure you that I am quite well versed in what "redevelopment" entails. I am also very (VERY) familiar with the sale and expected evolution of NorthTown. And calling it "redevelopment" is like calling McDonalds a steakhouse.

    Limiting choice? No. Just, no.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS View Post
    IDA's don't need to be abolished. They just need to be run better and I think they need to have a shift on what they focus on.

    Keeping on the topic of Amherst, the IDA help build the town into a powerhouse. There is no denying it's success for the town residents. If you're outside of Amherst..that's another story.

    That said, they need to change their focus from getting new development going to providing incentives for existing owners to invest back into their properties. For example, the Boulevard Mall is owned by Forest City Development. They have experience in EVERY kind of development from housing to mixed us to lifestyle centers.

    Now this Mall is on the way out but that does not mean it can't come back. Just imagine that instead of a sea of parking lots fronting NF Blvd, Maple and Alberta there was mid-rise residential with attached parking. For the mall itself, now that it would be surrounded by housing, you could attract a different type of tenant. Instead of just retail it could have everything from gyms to places to eat.

    Now is something like this feasible in Amherst? Who knows. There might not be a demand for it. That said, I think it's reasonable to explore. I think it's reasonable for the IDA to try and push a multi-point project like this rather than just working on the next office park.
    Boulevard Mall is on the way out???? WHAT????? It is not "on the way out". I'd love to know what benchmark is being used to categorize Blvd Mall as "on the way out".

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    Boulevard Mall is on the way out???? WHAT????? It is not "on the way out". I'd love to know what benchmark is being used to categorize Blvd Mall as "on the way out".
    A couple:

    1 - The list of stores is not as impressive. The anchor stores are low to middle end stores. The secondary stores are also middle of the road.
    2 - The food court is being converted due to the lack of traffic. It will now be a Dick's.
    3 - The inside of the mall needs a lot of work. It's dated.


    Lastly, and most importantly, the clientele is not the same as it used to be just 5-8 years ago. It's only a matter of time.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS View Post
    A couple:

    1 - The list of stores is not as impressive. The anchor stores are low to middle end stores. The secondary stores are also middle of the road.
    2 - The food court is being converted due to the lack of traffic. It will now be a Dick's.
    3 - The inside of the mall needs a lot of work. It's dated.


    Lastly, and most importantly, the clientele is not the same as it used to be just 5-8 years ago. It's only a matter of time.
    A matter of time. Quantify that please.

  6. #21
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    You know I like your name 2358 - anyway - what a concept ! Build some highrises near a mall - - sort of like building senior housing near a drug store or big grocery store !

    As far as the mall - tear out the heart of it where corridors intersect - build a new updated food court - but with more up scale restaurants - steak house - lobster and such (cold beers)! Make it more of a afternoon-early evening destination place. Shop - food - see a movie and walk home !

    I like it truly - I like it - think outside the box and go bigger.

    The big empty frontal parking lots sort of always looks empty - cold - uninviting.

    If we could keep the rental units in the apartments down around $1000.00 a month - I'm in ! Post info if this rolls forward - I truly like it - Thanks
    #Dems play musical chairs + patronage and nepotism = entitlement !

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    A matter of time. Quantify that please.

    Retail centers live and die off the consumers they attract. Based on the consumers, you're able to lease to specific tenants. Your tenants drive your ability to make improvements. You're ability to make improvements allows you to attract better consumers...which in turn attracts better tenants.

    Now I am going to go slow so you can follow along....

    The anchor stores set the tone for the mall. People go to malls to shop at multiple stores. Are you following so far?

    The Blvd Mall is anchored by JCP, Macy's and Sears. Big brands but they all serve a middle to lower class demographic. There is not a single high end department store. This means you're not going to attract a upper-middle class or upper class demographic.

    Because of this, the secondary stores adjust to the department stores. For example, the jewelers in the Blvd Mall consist of Claire's, Dakota Watch, Kay Jewelers, Littman Jewelers and Piercing Pagoda. Those are lower end stores. Same can be said for apparel. If you look at the directory, again, not a single upper end store.

    Third level tenants, like food and specialty follow last. Because of the above, the food court is closing because the type of shoppers are less likely to have disposable income for lunch or a treat while shopping. Because of the above, the specialty stores are 'As Seen on TV' not Brookstone because it's cheaper to sell junk.

    It's a downward spiral that many retailers face. I know this because I have two clients who are in the business. The first is a small town mall and the second is a shopping center in an OK neighborhood. Retail management companies are faced with either keeping stores closed until the 'right' kind of tenant comes along OR they need to fill the space with any tenant.

    What you're seeing in retail all over the US is either a huge investment is being made to upgrade the entire center to a lifestyle center. The lifestyle center concept is expensive but very promising if done right. The reason is your drawing pool for anchors and second level tenants becomes so much bigger. Now you can have a upscale grocer like whole foods or trader joes take the place of a highe end department store because they attract the same people. And then everything falls downstream.

    If a company does not believe in the idea of improvement enough to invest, they simply ride the wave of the downward spiral and cash out while they can. Unless the Blvd Mall makes a massive improvement...it's obvious the owners are just looking to ride the wave.

    If you don't get this...take a break and read again until you're able to comprehend.

  8. #23
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    Yeah. OK. That seems to imply that he only model that works involves so-called "high end" retail located directly on the site. I beg to differ. I believe that Boulevard Mall is one part of the retail landscape in the area. It serves a great purpose and need quite well.

    Also, I believe that your premise about the food court is incorrect. If it was closing for the cause you suggest, those restaurants would be gone completely. They are not. They are simply being moved to other location(s).

    And, no matter, you didn't you haven't quantified what you might mean by "success" and/or "failure"... and *when* you predict Boulevard Mall will actually "fail".

  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    Yeah. OK. That seems to imply that he only model that works involves so-called "high end" retail located directly on the site. I beg to differ. I believe that Boulevard Mall is one part of the retail landscape in the area. It serves a great purpose and need quite well.
    For the mall itself, it does apply.

    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    Also, I believe that your premise about the food court is incorrect. If it was closing for the cause you suggest, those restaurants would be gone completely. They are not. They are simply being moved to other location(s).
    The court is closing because there is not enough traffic to justify the food court.


    Look, you're entitled to your incorrect opinions here. What is going on with the Boulevard Mall is something that is happening to malls all over the US. I hope a renovation happens because that's the only thing that will stop the eventual closure. How long it takes does not matter. It's just a matter of time if something does not change.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    Yeah. OK. That seems to imply that he only model that works involves so-called "high end" retail located directly on the site. I beg to differ. I believe that Boulevard Mall is one part of the retail landscape in the area. It serves a great purpose and need quite well.
    You are all going to mock me but....

    The Walden Super Flea served a purpose to many low and very low income people. I know this because I tend to help very low income people with computer issues. Some people do not realize that a $100 dollar computer repair or a $150 refurbished computer purchase seriously eats into their basic budget. I realized this when over the years when people would ask if I would take payments over a couple of months on a $60 dollar dollar repair. I am referring to the real low income people. Not people who don't live within their means.

  11. #26
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    Original Boulevard Mall store The Bootery is closing. Just another domino to fall.


    Forty years ago, it was Ginny Everett’s children who sat next to her on the bench at Boulevard Mall Bootery having their feet carefully sized and measured. Thursday morning, it was her three-year-old grandson Lucas being meticulously fitted for shoes. A filing cabinet next to the register contained an index card with Lucas’s birthdate and ever-growing shoe size, just as it had held cards for her children years before. Co-owner Joe Toscano handed her a handwritten receipt and Lucas’s new shoes, thanked her by name and said goodbye.
    http://www.buffalonews.com/business/...-mall-20150514

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    Boulevard Mall is on the way out???? WHAT????? It is not "on the way out". I'd love to know what benchmark is being used to categorize Blvd Mall as "on the way out".

    Boulevard Mall, Buffalo’s oldest enclosed mall, put up for sale. LOL

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    And, no matter, you didn't you haven't quantified what you might mean by "success" and/or "failure"... and *when* you predict Boulevard Mall will actually "fail".

    Boulevard Mall owner facing default on loan

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Member 2358 View Post
    Unless there were other changes that were at least simultaneous, how would this help?

    And I think it's awesome that a post about golf courses yields a commentary on alleged vacant office buildings and now IDA's.

    If the golf courses are costing me, what, $0.85 a year in taxes, I have no problem in that subsidy. Yes, there are "soft" or peripheral costs... but until someone quantifies those relative to me, I'm hard pressed to link the two. For the record if the town sells the golf course(s), I'd prefer they be converted to a working farm. I'd love to drive along Maple Road and see cornfields for a mile or so.
    If the Govt. / Town of Amherst can subsidize a golf course...why not subsidize / build a shooting range, for licensed gun owners?? I dont play golf and would like to see my tax dollars paying for something that I and many other gun owners enjoy...after all...we subsidize, Hockey, Baseball, Football Lacrosse, Swimming, Basketball.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by joe d. View Post
    If the Govt. / Town of Amherst can subsidize a golf course...why not subsidize / build a shooting range, for licensed gun owners?? I dont play golf and would like to see my tax dollars paying for something that I and many other gun owners enjoy...after all...we subsidize, Hockey, Baseball, Football Lacrosse, Swimming, Basketball.
    If enough residents wanted a shooting range Amherst would have one. Maybe organize and pitch the board?

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