Construction nearing for West Seneca senior complex

[steven]

With an inducement package in hand from of the Erie County Industrial Development Agency, the developer of an independent senior housing complex in West Seneca expects to start construction on the project next month.

Michael Joseph, president of Clover Construction Management Inc. and Clover Management Inc., confirmed his company will begin work on the 107-apartment unit project in early May. The $6.84 million project is slated for a 5.6 acre vacant parcel along Union Road.

http://www.bizjournals.com/buffalo/s...ml?jst=b_ln_hl

[BigGuy]

Despite strenuous objections from the Chair of the Board of Fire Commissioners of the local Fire District, Union (W.S. #2), the WS Town Board approved the project 5-0. So much for working with those who will provide services to the apartments!

This is what happens when there are no involved individuals on our Town Boards. None of these "leaders" ever got out of bed for a first aid call at
5 AM, or did any real community service. Typical.

This is Paul Clark's "fire & first aid volunteers be damned, I'm running for County Executive so don't get in my way" attitude.

[count alucard]

The reason the Union Fire department chief is upset with the recent project that was approved, is because it is senior housing. Seniors unfortunately need first aid more than the general population. Yes there are a number of senior complexes in the Union District, probably more than any fire district in town. This is because the available space just happened to be there. I don't think that it was a preconceived plan to dump on Union Fire District.

If you study the age of the residents you will find that West Seneca has a tremendous number of senior citizens. I read that of the over 33,000 registered voters in West Seneca, over 9,300 are over 60 years old. That is an incredible statistic. The proposed West Seneca Comprehensive Plan has stated that the town needs more senior housing because the present supply is woefully inadequate.

This new senior complex will bring in probably close to $500,000 per year in property tax revenue to the town, school district and county. If it is properly assessed. The fire district gets a portion of this tax revenue. Union Fire District will receive a nice windfall from the project.

The firemen and women who volunteer their time to the residents of the Town is very commendable. They are heroes in the community and the community tries to give back. Volunteer firefighters get a property tax credit and a small pension for their service. The chiefs drive around in taxpayer supplied cars. These West Seneca Fire District cars can be spotted throughout Western New York. It is a free personal car. They have some of the best fire fighting equipment around. It's not like the taxpayers don't give them anything in return.

The individual who spoke in front of the Town Board was an embarrassment. He came in wearing his fire uniform complaining about his job, demanding that the volunteers get paid for their efforts. He didn't mention that he presently has an ax to grind with the Town Board in regard to a neighbor dispute he is having with the restaurant he lives next door to. That ill will seems to be his main motivational factor and not the seniors that his department proudly helps everyday.

I hope that this selfish individual does not represent all the fire fighters in the Town of West Seneca. If he does then the residents will not be getting the best fire protection as possible. I tend to think otherwise. Most firefighters are a special breed. It's unfortunate that a chief is using his fire department for his own personal gain. He should be ashamed of himself. I have never heard a fireman whine about too many calls.

A possible solution would be to redraw the Union District lines to make fire calls more equitable. Perhaps it's time to look at the way fire districts are set up in West Seneca. The taxpayers could save a whole lot of money by consolidating the 6 districts into 1 with stations set up around town. In this era of high taxes in West Seneca, the Fire Districts may be a place to look in order to save money. Oh yes, the Union chief failed to mention that Union wants to build a new facility that will cost the taxpayers millions of dollars! This consolidation may end the whining and turf wars that this chief is trying to perpetuate and save a whole lot of money.

Volunteer firemen and women are the elite volunteers in a community, but they are not the only volunteers. Unfortunately not everyone can be a fireman. But people volunteer in other ways in the community and get no compensation in return. They may be a volunteer coach on one of the many childrens' teams. They may volunteer at their church or their senior center. They may volunteer in scouting. They could volunteer as a member of the Lions, Kiwanis or Rotary Clubs that give back to the town. How about the veterans groups that are staging events throughout the town. And what about the people that volunteer to pick up garbage along our highways. The list goes on. They all make the town a better place. And to have one selfish fireman with his own agenda bitch is a disgrace to all the men and women that wear their uniforms proudly. This man should resign.

And chief, the next time you go on one of those calls, remember that person that is counting on you could have been a volunteer of some kind years ago. A person that helped others just like you.

__________________________________________________ _________

The count says:

"It's better to look forward than backward."

[BigGuy]

Count:

Some of your statements are justifiable, but I think you are taking this gentleman's appearance too far.

By the way, the gentleman in question is the Chair of the Board of Fire Commissioners, elected by the general public.

He is not the Chief of the Fire Company, which is a "not for profit" corporation, who is elected by the membership.

These "senior complex" groupings place a HUGE strain on volunteer fire companies. Many of them have "pull chains" in the bathrooms, which are all too often false alarms, found out long after the tones are sent out and people are on the way from their homes to the fire hall to man the trucks.
Noone is there to check these alarms out before they are sent direct to dispatch.

Fire District boundaries are established in NYS law by local government resolution. The present boundaries of the six districts were established long, long ago.

Different districts respond to increased call demands in different ways. Fire District #3 (Reserve) built a sub station in the sixties to handle the new residential demand on the east side of Union Road.

District #2's station fronting on Union Road is long outdated and woefully inadequate. It was built in the thirties or fourties, with an expansion fourty years ago. New equipment doesn't fit and additional requirements of EMS and OSHA necessitate more space.

Tax breaks? West Seneca's residential tax break for volunteers is a maximum of $25 per year. Maximum. Gee, thanks.

Pensions? It's called a Service Award, it's taxable, and only adds up to something worthwhile after many years of active service.

Chief's Cars? Each district has a policy, approved by the NY State Comptroller's office, regulating use. Lower level chiefs (assistants) use their own cars, which they have to drill huge holes into to accomodate lights, sirens, radios, etc.

Before you criticize, Mister Count, walk the walk.

[count alucard]

Thank You Big Guy for your reply. I have a question on the chair position. Is he directly elected by the general population of the town or elected by the Commisioners of the fire companies in town?

Secondly, the $25 credit seems to be terribly low. That number doesn't sound right. If it is that low, then the fire companies should petition the town to raise it in order to present an incentive to increase the number of members. They deserve more than $25 per year. Maybe that is the amount a member gets that makes very few calls. That's much too low.

As far as the district lines go, if they are instituted by law they can be changed by law. These things were drawn up in the horse and buggy days. Winchester has offered to take in certain areas of the Union District and they were turned down. Could the safety of town residents be jeopardized by Union's action? They would have to give up the tax revenue to Winchester. What comes first, safety or revenue? If Winchester can get to areas of Union District faster, then that area should be in Winchester's District. Turf wars in the Fire Companies endanger the lives of the people that the brave firefighters are trying to protect. There is no place for that. Consolidation into one fire district would eliminate this instantly, cost less and improve safety. I know that there are many firefighters in town that would not be against such a plan. What would the negatives be?

Every segment of the population presents certain challenges to any town. Young families with children put a strain on the school system. Seniors don't use the school system but often times put a strain on first aid services. That's the way life goes. You're born, become old and die. There are many seniors scattered around down. These senior complexes put many older people in one place. As a community we all are one. I can't agree with the the idea that a complex should not be built because the Fire Chair does not want to make fire calls there. I'm sorry, that is not a good reason. Do all the commisioners feel the same way?

Union Fire Company will get a tax windfall by these for-profit housing projects. This windfall could help upgrade their facilities. It could be a winning situation for Union. I remember the old fire hall on the corner of Race and Union back in the 50's. The present fire hall must have been built in the 50's or 60's.

As far as pensions go, none are worthwhile unless you have been in them for a long time. That's the way pensions work. Many people in West Seneca work jobs and never see a pension at all.

It sounds like Union needs to recruit more members. This could alleviate some of the stress. I have seen signs around town promoting just that. Perhaps a more aggressive recruitment campaign in the schools and through the Town government could help in that area.

I agree with you that Mr. Clark could do a better job in managing the town. A part-time Supervisor can not do proper service that requires full time effort. Now that he is running for County Executive, that will mean even less time for Supervisor business. This was evident when he ran for Congress in 2004. Issues were not addressed and were allowed to fester. The assessors office is just one of those issues. I am not trying to bash Clark's personality, just his performance. He has wanted to go on to bigger and better things for a long time. His shelf life is over as Supervisor.

Big Guy, I like your spirit and would be proud to walk the walk with you any time.

__________________________________________________ ______________

The count says:

"It's better to look forward than backward."

[BigGuy]

Hello again, Count.

The Chair of the Board of Fire Commissioners at District #2 is the Chairman for that Fire District only, and is elected by the five publically elected Commissioners. Each of the six West Seneca Districts has a Chairman, who runs the meetings. Most circulate the job each year (taking turns) to distribute the work. I guess it just happens to be Mr. Doster's turn this year.

The tax break "granted" by the town board is about $25 per year, a percentage reduction in your assessment. It is the same if you answer 5 or 500 calls per year. The State Legislature passed a proposed a volunteer firefighter's tax deduction of $200 per year, but Governor Pataki vetoed it, along with 201 other things. Let's hope the Senate and Assembly over ride this guy.

These apartment complexes are being built with enhancements. If they are being given tax breaks, then the fire district, which is a special district setting it's own tax rate, is often also included in the "break". I don't think that's right, but that's how (I believe) it happens. so, no additional revenue for the extra expense to the fire district.

No one looks for more calls, as that means someone is in trouble. These calls are often just more of a nuisance than others, as I stated before, and a good percentage are false alarms.

Oh, well. Life goes on. Let's see what happens in West Seneca with new leadership after next year.

[therising]

These apartment complexes are being built with enhancements. If they are being given tax breaks, then the fire district, which is a special district setting it's own tax rate, is often also included in the "break". I don't think that's right, but that's how (I believe) it happens. so, no additional revenue for the extra expense to the fire district.

No one looks for more calls, as that means someone is in trouble. These calls are often just more of a nuisance than others, as I stated before, and a good percentage are false alarms.

First of all, I'm pretty sure you're wrong on the tax break part. "Special Taxes", ie school, lighting, etc, are normally not abated. If its different in this case, I stand corrected.

Secondly, I don't get the whole issue that fire departments have with senior housing. These old people are not new to the area; most families place their elderly parents as close to their homes as possible. So, I would bet that 90% of the seniors that will be living there came from the Town, anyway. (Granted, this one may be a bit different, as it's on the WS/Cheek border). I really doubt we're getting many retirees moving here from out of the area.

Point being, these people are not coming out of the woodwork. Isn't it better to have all these first aid calls going to one place, as opposed to being scattered all over town?

Thirdly, doesn't it seem like discrimination against the old folks, when firefighters whine about this? Seems more than a bit tasteless if you ask me. Still, if anyone has a suggestion as to how we can terminate the first aid calls that these pesky old people create, I'm all ears.

Finally - I know someone (ahem, Res) will soon ask the question of "Why does Senior Housing get tax breaks, anyway?" The reasoning behind it is this: The Seniors are currently getting Star Tax breaks in their homes, anyway. So, why not transfer the tax break to the apartment building, and let a new, younger, full-tax-paying person purchase their home.

If we're going to start Nimbyism against old people, then we're all on our way straight to hell.

[WNYresident]

I dont see anyone getting a tax break so that they are paying what a lot of others are paying around the United States. We pay a lot to live in NYS and NYS has to realize it's nothing special. I mean it's nice and all but one can only pay so much just to live.

You made an excellent point that everyone can learn from.

These old people are not new to the area; most families place their elderly parents as close to their homes as possible.

Point being, these people are not coming out of the woodwork. Isn't it better to have all these first aid calls going to one place, as opposed to being scattered all over town?

Couldn't of said it better myself.

But is this a "senior" money making business when you build something with that many rooms other than what you make selling each unit? What did people do before the 1900's, 1940's with thier elderly in general?

Where there little multi-unit elderly complexes long before the newer assisted living developments we see today?

Is it's possible to build a senior center and basically just market it county wide to get people to move into the center because you are selling a "Service" to the elderly getting your clientel from anywhere you can. If you are making some serious cash from your service to the elderly then there is NO reason why you can't pay full property taxes on your elderly hotel business. What's the short version of the business model if a elderly developement like this? Can someone who lives in state import a parent from out of state and drop them into one of these places? AND what happens if that person runs out of money from a assistant living center. Does the state take over to cover thier cost there?

Are they building a small development setting where older people go to live at a true reduced rate to be there or more as a "care center with 100 small apartments? Or is it a "business" raking in some serious dough at the expense of the tax payer. Who acutally benefits the most from the tax discount they get?

I hope I'm explaining myself the way I mean to.

[BigGuy]

I like the rising's take on NIMBY ism and the progression of straight to hell.

The BANANA theory is what is also prevelent - Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything - because someone is always whining.

[TheCoolerKeg]

I like the rising's take on NIMBY ism and the progression of straight to hell.

The BANANA theory is what is also prevelent - Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything - because someone is always whining.

Oh boy! You are on a rampage of ignorance!