Town Garbage Totes

[NewPublius]

The Town of Tonawanda Board will be voting on Garbage Totes tonight. I assume that if things go like normal they'll vote 5-2 shortly after ignoring the people once again.
http://www.tonawanda.ny.us/townclerk...2003-13-06.htm

The Town does have a rat problem, especially on the borders, and totes should fix it. Also Buffalo has totes and we know Buffalo has been a model for government and we're all very jealous of their totes...

On the other hand, my sources tell me there isn't a lot of money to go around this year and upgrading the trucks to take totes will cost in the multiple millions of dollars, each tote will come along with a hefty rental fee. There’s also pure speculation that the trucks will only be able to do one side of a street at a time (ala Kenmore) raising the cost of collection.

Points I'm sure we'll hear tonight will be that.
1. there are rats
2. rats eat garbage
3. garbage costs more to dump if its wet and a container of some type will keep it dry, a tote would fit that bill.
4. Bigger garbage trucks are better

1-3 are definitely valid points. The sad thing is that passing a container law will do the same thing and cost the town (almost) nothing. I've heard arguments that enforcement will be needed, but that’s the same for totes. Next argument I hear is that if its not in a tote you just don't pick it up. There’s two sides to the argument there. 1. If its not in a conforming container don't pick it up or 2. If you don't pick up trash you're not helping the rat problem. So ultimately to get rid of rats someone has to check that people are using containers and possibly give out fines depending on how serious of a rat problem remains, but that has to be done no matter what kind of container is used, a yearly rented one from the town or a el-cheapo can a resident has had for ten years and taken good care of. (The enforcement could pay for itself with fines, again that’s true in both cases.) Only part of the town has rats, but after tonight I'm sure every resident will have to pay that yearly rental fee for a rat-proof can.

Its my position that garbage totes take responsibility out of hands of the people to maintain a ratproof container, spends their money when it doesn't need to be spent and its not even available to spend, and creates a permanent annual burden on the taxpayer in the form of tote rental fees.

Something has to be done, and last years board knew there was a rat problem and sat on their hands. I just don't think this year’s board is going to do the right thing, considering they have their minds made up already... (Maybe I'm kind of a defeatist, but if you observe the poor body language and doubletalk answers that certain board members give their residents who get up to talk, I think you'd understand where I come from.)

Does anyone else have any feelings? This forum seems pretty dead.
Maybe just some guesses on the kinds of doubletalk would be fun. There was a lot of it out of left field last meeting (minutes to all meetings are eventually posted here, usually Cal takes his time though. http://www.tonawanda.ny.us/townboard...mtg%202006.htm)

[atotaltotalfan2001]

The Town of Tonawanda Board will be voting on Garbage Totes tonight. I assume that if things go like normal they'll vote 5-2 shortly after ignoring the people once again.
http://www.tonawanda.ny.us/townclerk...2003-13-06.htm

The Town does have a rat problem, especially on the borders, and totes should fix it. Also Buffalo has totes and we know Buffalo has been a model for government and we're all very jealous of their totes...

On the other hand, my sources tell me there isn't a lot of money to go around this year and upgrading the trucks to take totes will cost in the multiple millions of dollars, each tote will come along with a hefty rental fee. There’s also pure speculation that the trucks will only be able to do one side of a street at a time (ala Kenmore) raising the cost of collection.

Points I'm sure we'll hear tonight will be that.
1. there are rats
2. rats eat garbage
3. garbage costs more to dump if its wet and a container of some type will keep it dry, a tote would fit that bill.
4. Bigger garbage trucks are better

1-3 are definitely valid points. The sad thing is that passing a container law will do the same thing and cost the town (almost) nothing. I've heard arguments that enforcement will be needed, but that’s the same for totes. Next argument I hear is that if its not in a tote you just don't pick it up. There’s two sides to the argument there. 1. If its not in a conforming container don't pick it up or 2. If you don't pick up trash you're not helping the rat problem. So ultimately to get rid of rats someone has to check that people are using containers and possibly give out fines depending on how serious of a rat problem remains, but that has to be done no matter what kind of container is used, a yearly rented one from the town or a el-cheapo can a resident has had for ten years and taken good care of. (The enforcement could pay for itself with fines, again that’s true in both cases.) Only part of the town has rats, but after tonight I'm sure every resident will have to pay that yearly rental fee for a rat-proof can.

Its my position that garbage totes take responsibility out of hands of the people to maintain a ratproof container, spends their money when it doesn't need to be spent and its not even available to spend, and creates a permanent annual burden on the taxpayer in the form of tote rental fees.

Something has to be done, and last years board knew there was a rat problem and sat on their hands. I just don't think this year’s board is going to do the right thing, considering they have their minds made up already... (Maybe I'm kind of a defeatist, but if you observe the poor body language and doubletalk answers that certain board members give their residents who get up to talk, I think you'd understand where I come from.)

Does anyone else have any feelings? This forum seems pretty dead.
Maybe just some guesses on the kinds of doubletalk would be fun. There was a lot of it out of left field last meeting (minutes to all meetings are eventually posted here, usually Cal takes his time though. http://www.tonawanda.ny.us/townboard...mtg%202006.htm)

Hmmm. Let me quess. You're a Republican, right? You're also against downsizing the town board, correct?

[NewPublius]

Hmmm. Let me quess. You're a Republican, right? You're also against downsizing the town board, correct?

Yes, I vote Republican at the town level. I think that's obvious from my post (fiscal responsibility, low taxes, smart decisions).

Off-topic:
I'm actually indifferent to downsizing the town board. I think there should be only as many members on the board as necessary to run the town properly. From my understanding the recent push for downsizing the town board is politically motivated (then again what isn't?), so I'm against it for that. But if the Board will function fine then its (R) less taxes or (D) more money for something else.
If you want to respond to this, start a new thread (It won't get lost in that huge list of two topics). Thanks for hi-jacking this one.

As for Garbage, this forum suggested some links after my post. I think this is an interesting read:
http://forums.speakupwny.com/showthread.php?t=4370
It shows that Cheektowaga is interested in the input of its residents. There’s also some unsupported talk of the trucks being unreliable. I don't know if that’s true, but it’s an interesting point if it is.

Anyone have any thoughts about Garbage?

[atotaltotalfan2001]

Yes, I vote Republican at the town level. I think that's obvious from my post (fiscal responsibility, low taxes, smart decisions).

Off-topic:
I'm actually indifferent to downsizing the town board. I think there should be only as many members on the board as necessary to run the town properly. From my understanding the recent push for downsizing the town board is politically motivated (then again what isn't?), so I'm against it for that. But if the Board will function fine then its (R) less taxes or (D) more money for something else.
If you want to respond to this, start a new thread (It won't get lost in that huge list of two topics). Thanks for hi-jacking this one.

As for Garbage, this forum suggested some links after my post. I think this is an interesting read:
http://forums.speakupwny.com/showthread.php?t=4370
It shows that Cheektowaga is interested in the input of its residents. There’s also some unsupported talk of the trucks being unreliable. I don't know if that’s true, but it’s an interesting point if it is.

Anyone have any thoughts about Garbage?

You mean aside from the political points the town Republican Committee hopes to score against the Dem majority by framing the tote issue as taxpayer waste?

Somehow, I smell a rat, one that is more interested in politics than what's best for residents.

[NewPublius]

You mean aside from the political points the town Republican Committee hopes to score against the Dem majority by framing the tote issue as taxpayer waste?

Somehow, I smell a rat, one that is more interested in politics than what's best for residents.

I proposed an alternative solution, do you have any thoughts on it?

I admit that I got wind of this from a friend who is an aquaintence of someone who is close friends with people involved with the Town Republicans, but I don't consider being concerned about taxes from third hand information being a political henchman. I think you'll have better luck playing the six degrees of Kevin Bacon game than trying to tie me to the Town Republicans. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Degrees_of_Kevin_Bacon)

It seems to me that you are trying to frame this in a political light. Why don't you discuss my plan? I think totes will work, but I think my suggestion will work just as well without spending as much money. I came up with it on my own, I don't even know if the town republicans agree as I haven't discussed it with anyone outside of my family until posting it this morning.

[atotaltotalfan2001]

I proposed an alternative solution, do you have any thoughts on it?

I admit that I got wind of this from a friend who is an aquaintence of someone who is close friends with people involved with the Town Republicans, but I don't consider being concerned about taxes from third hand information being a political henchman. I think you'll have better luck playing the six degrees of Kevin Bacon game than trying to tie me to the Town Republicans. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Degrees_of_Kevin_Bacon)

It seems to me that you are trying to frame this in a political light. Why don't you discuss my plan? I think totes will work, but I think my suggestion will work just as well without spending as much money. I came up with it on my own, I don't even know if the town republicans agree as I haven't discussed it with anyone outside of my family until posting it this morning.

Okay. I'll take a closer look.