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Thread: Creating Olmsted High School wins support of School Board committee

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    Creating Olmsted High School wins support of School Board committee

    The Buffalo Board of Education reacted enthusiastically Wednesday evening to a proposal to establish a long-sought Olmsted High School next September, with a goal of making it as popular and successful as City Honors School and Hutchinson Central Technical High School.


    Board members also seemed reasonably comfortable with plans to close two existing schools in September, along with two other schools now being used to temporarily house students displaced by reconstruction projects.

    The highlight of the plan, unveiled at the board's Finance and Operations Committee, is the creation of Olmsted High School at the former Kensington High School, 319 Suffolk Ave.
    The school would be designed as an attractive option for college-bound students who have long competed for scarce seats at City Honors and Hutch-Tech and would emphasize academic rigor, creative thinking and community service.

    http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial...04/1020816.asp
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    Just what Buffalo needs ... another high school when it has 15 already and should have only about 7 or 8. All Buffalo high schools ought to "emphasize academic rigor, creative thinking and community service" not just those for the "elite".
    Your right to buy a military weapon without hindrance, delay or training cannot trump Daniel Barden’s right to see his eighth birthday. -- Jim Himes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda_D
    Just what Buffalo needs ... another high school when it has 15 already and should have only about 7 or 8. All Buffalo high schools ought to "emphasize academic rigor, creative thinking and community service" not just those for the "elite".

    Why are you such a negative Nancy? First off, it is using an existing building in a run down area. Secondly, it creates more opportunity for kids who really want an education.

    Yes you are correct that ALL Buffalo HS should look to "emphasize academic rigor, creative thinking and community service" but I do not see this as an elitist agenda. Remember that the kids who will be attending these three schools are not turning down Nichols or a Catholic HS. They are kids who would otherwise get lost in the shuffle.

    What is funny is by you disagreeing with this concept, you are contradicting your opinion on development and how it should happen. When it comes to development you do not want to see broad strokes like LTR, Skyway and the like. When it comes to education you want to see broad strokes by applying excellence to every school.

    So if your theory of broad strokes in development will not work, then you have to apply the same principals to education.

    I say convert schools one by one to the standards of Hutch Tech and City Honors. Eventually they will rival the suburban education. In fact, Hutch Tech and City Honors provide a better education then a lot of suburban schools today.

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    Member Linda_D's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS
    Why are you such a negative Nancy? First off, it is using an existing building in a run down area. Secondly, it creates more opportunity for kids who really want an education.

    Yes you are correct that ALL Buffalo HS should look to "emphasize academic rigor, creative thinking and community service" but I do not see this as an elitist agenda. Remember that the kids who will be attending these three schools are not turning down Nichols or a Catholic HS. They are kids who would otherwise get lost in the shuffle.

    What is funny is by you disagreeing with this concept, you are contradicting your opinion on development and how it should happen. When it comes to development you do not want to see broad strokes like LTR, Skyway and the like. When it comes to education you want to see broad strokes by applying excellence to every school.

    So if your theory of broad strokes in development will not work, then you have to apply the same principals to education.

    I say convert schools one by one to the standards of Hutch Tech and City Honors. Eventually they will rival the suburban education. In fact, Hutch Tech and City Honors provide a better education then a lot of suburban schools today.
    Since you know less about education than you do about development, I suggest you stick to development fantasies.

    Buffalo operates an educational system based on pre-WWII models where a high school degree was a terminal degree. That's why it still operates vocational schools supposedly teaching "job skills" but which aren't rigorous or up-to-date enough to churn out students who can do more than ask, "Do you want fries with that?" The city's supposed "academic high schools" are probably even worse since they get all the students who can't get into vocational schools. That's why "the best" students try to get into CH or Hutch.

    Hutch Tech and City Honors skim the best students from all of Buffalo into their student bodies. City Honors takes the "best" 100 from the 8th grade class. Most of that 100 got there because their parents got them in when they were in 5th grade. There's usually only about 20 openings for the CH freshman class -- and these aren't kids who drop out, so there are few openings after that. Hutch Tech takes the best 250 or so, mostly based on an entrance test taken in 8th grade.

    The NYS Regents have mandated a rigorous academic curriculum that recognizes that most students will go on to some kind of post-high school education. This means that most students have to take the same curriculum, basically college entrance, so there's no longer any need or excuse to keep all these small, specialized elitist high schools going. All they do is provide cushy jobs for administrators and schools department bureaucrats.

    Buffalo needs to have high schools based on attendance districts like the suburban schools have. Every high school then has honors classes based on students' performance in high school not on what they did in 4th or 8th grade. Every high school should offer foreign languages, music programs, art classes, lab sciences, etc. As junior or seniors, those students who show interest, can attend a central vocation school for some classes.

    That's how suburban and rural school districts work, and that's how the small city school districts. It's time for Buffalo to join the 21st century.
    Your right to buy a military weapon without hindrance, delay or training cannot trump Daniel Barden’s right to see his eighth birthday. -- Jim Himes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Linda_D
    Since you know less about education than you do about development, I suggest you stick to development fantasies.

    Buffalo operates an educational system based on pre-WWII models where a high school degree was a terminal degree. That's why it still operates vocational schools supposedly teaching "job skills" but which aren't rigorous or up-to-date enough to churn out students who can do more than ask, "Do you want fries with that?" The city's supposed "academic high schools" are probably even worse since they get all the students who can't get into vocational schools. That's why "the best" students try to get into CH or Hutch.

    Hutch Tech and City Honors skim the best students from all of Buffalo into their student bodies. City Honors takes the "best" 100 from the 8th grade class. Most of that 100 got there because their parents got them in when they were in 5th grade. There's usually only about 20 openings for the CH freshman class -- and these aren't kids who drop out, so there are few openings after that. Hutch Tech takes the best 250 or so, mostly based on an entrance test taken in 8th grade.

    The NYS Regents have mandated a rigorous academic curriculum that recognizes that most students will go on to some kind of post-high school education. This means that most students have to take the same curriculum, basically college entrance, so there's no longer any need or excuse to keep all these small, specialized elitist high schools going. All they do is provide cushy jobs for administrators and schools department bureaucrats.

    Buffalo needs to have high schools based on attendance districts like the suburban schools have. Every high school then has honors classes based on students' performance in high school not on what they did in 4th or 8th grade. Every high school should offer foreign languages, music programs, art classes, lab sciences, etc. As junior or seniors, those students who show interest, can attend a central vocation school for some classes.

    That's how suburban and rural school districts work, and that's how the small city school districts. It's time for Buffalo to join the 21st century.

    First off, I have never claimed to be an expert on anything like you have. I simply have strong opinion and use research to back up my opinions. You on the other hand are known for just pulling stuff out of the sky.


    My point was you are against wide spread reform or agendas when it comes to development. When it comes to education, you are for wide spread reform. You have a contradiction is philosophy. Simply because you only say or think or see what supports your opinion.

    This is a measured step. I would rather have 750 have the opportunity to compete to receive a great education then throw money at a broke system.

    I am all for every HS offering advanced classed, music and art programs. I am more for year round music and athletic programs. It has been proven that busy kids are less likely to get into trouble and do better in school.
    But that can not happen in Buffalo schools as the schools are now. The entire system is broke. Much like EVERYTHING in Buffalo. This is a small step. Two years down the road, expand to 4 such schools. Then 5 and 6.

    We must break the cycle. In order to do this, some people have to get left out. It is sad but true. Just like welfare. There are generations of people who are on welfare. It is a way of life. Were they born that way? No. When they were 5 did they dream of being on welfare? No. But at some point people enter into the cycle. Most rich kids become rich adults. Most poor kids become poor adults. Most educated parents have educated kids. Most uneducated parents have uneducated kids. It is all a cycle.

    Schools like this break the cycle for the kids attend. Yes it is only 750-1000 of the thousands of kids in the system. But that is a victory. Once you break the cycle for 1000 make the goal 1500.

    You say spending money on taking down the skyway or building LTR is a wast of money. When it has been proven to give a return. But with this, you would rather taxpayers invest more money on something that has proven to not give a return. That is just silly.

    This is harsh but there are not many people who pay 12k a year in school taxes in Buffalo. Yet this is what is spent on every kid. So parents with kids are taking more from the system then they are giving. With this being the case, I see no problems with creating a couple of advanced schools for kids who want opportunity can find opportunity. Let a little competition happen. Only good can come from it.

    I am a 4th generation Irish American. Every generation of my family has done better then the last. My parents made sure I got more of an education then they did. My grandparents made sure my parents did not go into the mills. My great-grandparents made sure my grandparents were not in the ghettos of the 1st ward. Each generation made sacrifices for the next. This is the great American tradition. Problem is people like you want all of the advancements without the sacrifice to be offered to everyone.

    I say let the competition begin. 750-1000 kids now, 1500 in 4 years and 2000 in 8. In under 20 years the system CAN be repaired. But it has to start somewhere.

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    The answer is vouchers and/or tax credits. This will create choice and competition leading to better schools without relying on further expensive and failing government plans.
    The path is clear
    Though no eyes can see
    The course laid down long before.
    And so with gods and men
    The sheep remain inside their pen,
    Though many times they've seen the way to leave.

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    what I find puzzling about your opinion Linda is from what I have seen on the board your against the hospital closings but not for the charter schools.

    Why should patients have choice in hospitals but not parents with schools?

    My youngest son attends a charter school and Im gratified to think you classify me as "elite". My wallet on the other hand may argue that point with you
    People who wonder if the glass is half empty or full miss the point. The glass is refillable.

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    Steven an elitist? That is funny
    The path is clear
    Though no eyes can see
    The course laid down long before.
    And so with gods and men
    The sheep remain inside their pen,
    Though many times they've seen the way to leave.

  9. #9
    Member steven's Avatar
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    hey u, I bought a round or two last time we where together!
    People who wonder if the glass is half empty or full miss the point. The glass is refillable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS
    First off, I have never claimed to be an expert on anything like you have. I simply have strong opinion and use research to back up my opinions. You on the other hand are known for just pulling stuff out of the sky.


    My point was you are against wide spread reform or agendas when it comes to development. When it comes to education, you are for wide spread reform. You have a contradiction is philosophy. Simply because you only say or think or see what supports your opinion.

    This is a measured step. I would rather have 750 have the opportunity to compete to receive a great education then throw money at a broke system.

    I am all for every HS offering advanced classed, music and art programs. I am more for year round music and athletic programs. It has been proven that busy kids are less likely to get into trouble and do better in school.
    But that can not happen in Buffalo schools as the schools are now. The entire system is broke. Much like EVERYTHING in Buffalo. This is a small step. Two years down the road, expand to 4 such schools. Then 5 and 6.

    We must break the cycle. In order to do this, some people have to get left out. It is sad but true. Just like welfare. There are generations of people who are on welfare. It is a way of life. Were they born that way? No. When they were 5 did they dream of being on welfare? No. But at some point people enter into the cycle. Most rich kids become rich adults. Most poor kids become poor adults. Most educated parents have educated kids. Most uneducated parents have uneducated kids. It is all a cycle.

    Schools like this break the cycle for the kids attend. Yes it is only 750-1000 of the thousands of kids in the system. But that is a victory. Once you break the cycle for 1000 make the goal 1500.

    You say spending money on taking down the skyway or building LTR is a wast of money. When it has been proven to give a return. But with this, you would rather taxpayers invest more money on something that has proven to not give a return. That is just silly.

    This is harsh but there are not many people who pay 12k a year in school taxes in Buffalo. Yet this is what is spent on every kid. So parents with kids are taking more from the system then they are giving. With this being the case, I see no problems with creating a couple of advanced schools for kids who want opportunity can find opportunity. Let a little competition happen. Only good can come from it.

    I am a 4th generation Irish American. Every generation of my family has done better then the last. My parents made sure I got more of an education then they did. My grandparents made sure my parents did not go into the mills. My great-grandparents made sure my grandparents were not in the ghettos of the 1st ward. Each generation made sacrifices for the next. This is the great American tradition. Problem is people like you want all of the advancements without the sacrifice to be offered to everyone.

    I say let the competition begin. 750-1000 kids now, 1500 in 4 years and 2000 in 8. In under 20 years the system CAN be repaired. But it has to start somewhere.
    I have to fully agree with you here.

    Throwing more money at education is not the answer, but changing the way education is delivered can be.

    Not all students will survive in an AP environment, but they will all need more eduction than in the past, even if they go into the trades.

    Micheal

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    hutch techs been usin ken high since last year while they been fixin up the old hutch. my brothers a sophomore there, he dont brag about himself so i will. every markin period since the second markin period of his freshmen year his grades have been in the top 3 of the whole school with around a 98 average. he told me he wishes he would of been a couple years behind so he could go to the new olmsted since he's been in the olmsted system since 1st grade. i told him yeah but at this rate your gonna graduate at 17 and instead of takin 2 buses and the train all you gotta do is walk 2 blocks to school. with me of course, bein it is a "run down area" right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by get_bent_pay_rent
    hutch techs been usin ken high since last year while they been fixin up the old hutch. my brothers a sophomore there, he dont brag about himself so i will. every markin period since the second markin period of his freshmen year his grades have been in the top 3 of the whole school with around a 98 average. he told me he wishes he would of been a couple years behind so he could go to the new olmsted since he's been in the olmsted system since 1st grade. i told him yeah but at this rate your gonna graduate at 17 and instead of takin 2 buses and the train all you gotta do is walk 2 blocks to school. with me of course, bein it is a "run down area" right?

    GBPY,

    Question for your brother. Obviously grades are a large part of his work. However, does he credit any of his success to being in the "Olmsted system" since 1st grade?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DelawareDistrict
    The answer is vouchers and/or tax credits. This will create choice and competition leading to better schools without relying on further expensive and failing government plans.
    Now that you're done with ECC, you're against public education!

    I'm sure that's "different" somehow...
    Your right to buy a military weapon without hindrance, delay or training cannot trump Daniel Barden’s right to see his eighth birthday. -- Jim Himes

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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS
    GBPY,

    Question for your brother. Obviously grades are a large part of his work. However, does he credit any of his success to being in the "Olmsted system" since 1st grade?
    thats a good question, i'll ask him when i see him tomorrow.

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    Member Linda_D's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leftWNYbecauseofBS
    First off, I have never claimed to be an expert on anything like you have. I simply have strong opinion and use research to back up my opinions. You on the other hand are known for just pulling stuff out of the sky.


    My point was you are against wide spread reform or agendas when it comes to development. When it comes to education, you are for wide spread reform. You have a contradiction is philosophy. Simply because you only say or think or see what supports your opinion.

    This is a measured step. I would rather have 750 have the opportunity to compete to receive a great education then throw money at a broke system.

    I am all for every HS offering advanced classed, music and art programs. I am more for year round music and athletic programs. It has been proven that busy kids are less likely to get into trouble and do better in school.
    But that can not happen in Buffalo schools as the schools are now. The entire system is broke. Much like EVERYTHING in Buffalo. This is a small step. Two years down the road, expand to 4 such schools. Then 5 and 6.

    We must break the cycle. In order to do this, some people have to get left out. It is sad but true. Just like welfare. There are generations of people who are on welfare. It is a way of life. Were they born that way? No. When they were 5 did they dream of being on welfare? No. But at some point people enter into the cycle. Most rich kids become rich adults. Most poor kids become poor adults. Most educated parents have educated kids. Most uneducated parents have uneducated kids. It is all a cycle.

    Schools like this break the cycle for the kids attend. Yes it is only 750-1000 of the thousands of kids in the system. But that is a victory. Once you break the cycle for 1000 make the goal 1500.

    You say spending money on taking down the skyway or building LTR is a wast of money. When it has been proven to give a return. But with this, you would rather taxpayers invest more money on something that has proven to not give a return. That is just silly.

    This is harsh but there are not many people who pay 12k a year in school taxes in Buffalo. Yet this is what is spent on every kid. So parents with kids are taking more from the system then they are giving. With this being the case, I see no problems with creating a couple of advanced schools for kids who want opportunity can find opportunity. Let a little competition happen. Only good can come from it.

    I am a 4th generation Irish American. Every generation of my family has done better then the last. My parents made sure I got more of an education then they did. My grandparents made sure my parents did not go into the mills. My great-grandparents made sure my grandparents were not in the ghettos of the 1st ward. Each generation made sacrifices for the next. This is the great American tradition. Problem is people like you want all of the advancements without the sacrifice to be offered to everyone.

    I say let the competition begin. 750-1000 kids now, 1500 in 4 years and 2000 in 8. In under 20 years the system CAN be repaired. But it has to start somewhere.
    Leftie, I'm sorry I snapped at you. I shouldn't have done that because I was in a lousy mood for a number of reasons. Mea culpa.

    Anyways, as a former teacher (in the Buffalo parochial schools), as a college liaison officer, as a parent, and as a taxpayer, I've maintained an interest in the education for a lot of years. I've dealt with urban, rural, and suburban schools for a lot of years. Buffalo's schools are the absolute worse run in all of upstate New York. It is a bureaucracy with the primary mission of keeping as many of its members well employed as possible. Keeping the bureaucracy fed is far more important than educating children, especially the children of ordinary citizens.

    If you look at charter schools around upstate NYS, you find a handful (about 3 or 4 each) in and around each of Upstate's big cities, and something like 10 or 12 and applications for more in Buffalo. Buffalo is not that much bigger than Rochester or Syracuse. There is little or no interest in charter schools in the Buffalo suburbs because there are no charters in the 'burbs nor many suburban students attending Buffalo charters. There doesn't seem to be much interest in charters in WNY's smaller cities, either. That there's such a large demand for charters in Buffalo ought to raise a red flag in the Schools Department, but aside from crying about money, nothing's been done.
    Your right to buy a military weapon without hindrance, delay or training cannot trump Daniel Barden’s right to see his eighth birthday. -- Jim Himes

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