Wages, taxes and the people who pay for it all

[WNYresident]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=6 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by WNYresident
You can't compare. If you notice ford and chevy are having issues.

You need to compare how it's effecting our community. You also can't compare and say.."well in vegas" they are paid... We are not vegas. We are WNY who needs to compete with other areas of the USA and Globally.
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Winfield31

:confused: I'm not asking to be compared with Vegas or even Hong Kong , but Clarence , Lancaster , Eden , etc. They're "living" the good life with excellent school systems , safer neighborhoods , very little (comparitively) "trash" , police actually "respond" , no one is burning down their homes en masse . The "money" has moved to the 'burbs , "they" seem to flourish out side the city proper ? Myself & my money have stayed & because I make more then the average "Joe" citizen (who's either retired , out of work , or on "public assistance" , staying home watching "The Price Is Right") , I'm to take a "cut" so I can subsidide the 'burbs or NYC) as that's where I have go (the 'burb's) to spend MOST of my money ? It's FAR more then this "global community economically" that have affected WNY........Don't just attack the local gov't............Ford , Chevy ,etc. has been "hurt" because of NAFTA , the EURO , importing/exporting , etc. These "other" countries are abusing their workers (AKA "forced/child" labor) & paying them nothing to make inferior products which we buy , blame whom ? Want to make Buffalo better , start with building at the "hub" , downtown , improve the school system , move back from the 'burbs & throw your tax dollars here............When you partially pay my salary , then your "mission statement" may take on more meaning to me.........& maybe then you can "critique" me , as I think the media is skewed , I think PC Programmers make far too much as "they" have us over the barrell , CEO's are bastardizing the WHOLE private sector , pushing the"middle-class" into a "lower class"........... Hey I live paycheck to paycheck as you probably do , don't we all ? I just don't "buy" your philosophy......

[WNYresident]

Winfield,

I think you misunderstood. I said across the entire system of government employee monopoly service departments. Not just Buffalo.

Government has become too fat and too costly with very very little to show in return for what we pay.

I understand as a community we will always need some form of government worker. That doesn't mean I expect to pay a "clerk" taking a dog license fee $35,000 or more plus benefits. Times are changing in the USA which means government salaries have to change to. Federal/State/County/Local.... I don't want to see the middle class disappear just so the "government" class isn't effected by a econimic downturn.

I'm not here to subsidize someone's work ability. Just because they can't make it in the private sector doesn't mean they go work for the government at wages higher then they could get in the private sector.

THe salaries can't be too bad. WHen was the last time you saw a group of local government employees leaving our area? Name 5 people you know from the public sector work force who left thier jobs because they weren't happy with thier salaries, benefits and pension plan. Just 5

[WNYresident]

Don't just attack the local gov't............Ford , Chevy ,etc. has been "hurt" because of NAFTA , the EURO , importing/exporting , etc. These "other" countries are abusing their workers (AKA "forced/child" labor) & paying them nothing to make inferior products which we buy , blame whom ?

I'm not attacking. I'm just stating there will be adjustments. Why should the "government" employee be shielded from an economic down turn? I can't come up with any reason at all. None.

Local businesses make cuts, owners lower thier salaries etc etc.... WHen the unions pull out an example of "WELL THIS CEO TOOK $30,000,000 in bonuses". Well that's a very very small percentage to the CEO's out there. The small 2 to 20 person business make cuts, salary adjustments and just work more to make ends meet. Those million dollar bonuses are far and few between.

Why wouldn't economic adjustments apply to government workers? Yes they pay higher prices like everyone else does but they have to make CUTS like everyone else does to.

Why haven't they? Because it's a service monopoly that has be broken so our area can prosper again or at lease stop businesses/people from leaving. It's current controlled by the local democratic party. Thats why I bring up Lenny Lenihans name up. You have to discredit the people (the company) who gives our area a crappy product. They are not looking to help the community, they are looking to help themselves.

Look over his endorsements.

Here is Tony's opinion on the product he has endorsed lately.

Pathetic.

He endorsed Keane. That would have been continued status quo. You should have went to the Heartstone fundraiser for Keane when he was running for CE. They video recorded it. They should play that tape for every WNY'er to let them see exactly what mentality is killing our community. Class warfare at it's best..

Look at our legislature. Another group of pathetic endorsements. Voting yes to $600 dollar bonuses to start negociations without an idea where the money would come from.

Didn't lenny endorse steve casey for mayor? Opps I mean Byron Brown. Look what that has gotten for Buffalo.

Oh... spitzer.... you know what I was told why Lenny endorsed him? He knew he could win. So what.... how about endorsing someone that would benefit our community not just the party instead?

I could go on but you see the pattern that the local core democratic party has.

Party first community second.

Oh I'm not saying any other party is any better either. I haven't seen much from any other party that benefited our area either.

[Achbek1]

Western New York has a higher percentage of government workers for a few reasons:

1.) There aren't a lot of large employers around here other than government entities. There really aren't any Fortune 500 companies or any industries other than "Health Care and Social Assistance." (Note: I'm curious to see the results of the most recent Economic Census. Let's see what industries employ the largest numbers of people in Erie County.)
2.) Some of those government workers, or actually MANY of them, work for government Social Service agencies. We mentioned in another thread that the fact that so many people in Erie County either WORK FOR Social Service or are ON Social Services are signs that something is wrong.
3.) Forgive me for being politically incorrect, but this is New York State, otherwise known as the state with the most... uh... "genrerous handouts." There are many people moving to this state to get the handouts, could it be that maybe those numbers eclipse or will eclipse the numbers of people who are coming here for work? There are also apparently, as from the recent reports of alcohol and drug abuse counselors being in great demand, many people who are addicted to drugs or who have other "in need of Social Services" issues. All those things drum up more Social Services worker and thus increase the number of government workers.

Also, the government jobs at least offer good pay and benefits. No wonder people in WNY are either fighting to work for the government or are left in a position to seek assistance from the governent.

Simply put, there's not many other places to go.

[Achbek1]

Okay, the 2007 data is still not released, but here is the 2002 data:

http://www.census.gov/econ/census02/data/ny/NY029.HTM

The industry with the largest individual number of employees in Erie County was "Health Care and SOCIAL ASSISTANCE" with 64,793 paid employees. Although the detailed data at http://www.census.gov/econ/census02/data/ny/NY029_62.HTM
states that only approximately 9,957 of those were "Social Assistance" specifically, the others are at hospitals, nursing facilities, etc.

The manufacturing industry came in with the second individual highest number of employees at 57,645. However this is 2002 data, I'm curious about what the more recent figures will show.

Yet the third industry with the individual highest number of employees is RETAIL TRADE! That industry is right under manufacturing with 53,521 paid employees. EEEEEK! You hear economists talk about what happens when we become more of a "low paying, service job" economy.

Note: Don't yell at me and say, "But YOU always want to promote the opening of new retail establishments!" I do in that they are a PART of the economic ecosystem, but I also promote new and bigger industries moving into the area or developing in the area.

Coming in fourth with 33,249 paid employees is what is defined as "Administrative & support & waste management & remediation service." (Tony Soprano?!) The detailed data http://www.census.gov/econ/census02/data/ny/NY029_56.HTM states that only approximately 738 of those are in the "Waste management & remediation services" area. (Sorry Tony Soprano.)

[GG716]

Okay, the 2007 data is still not released, but here is the 2002 data:

http://www.census.gov/econ/census02/data/ny/NY029.HTM

The industry with the largest individual number of employees in Erie County was "Health Care and SOCIAL ASSISTANCE" with 64,793 paid employees. Although the detailed data at http://www.census.gov/econ/census02/data/ny/NY029_62.HTM
states that only approximately 9,957 of those were "Social Assistance" specifically, the others are at hospitals, nursing facilities, etc.

The manufacturing industry came in with the second individual highest number of employees at 57,645. However this is 2002 data, I'm curious about what the more recent figures will show.

Yet the third industry with the individual highest number of employees is RETAIL TRADE! That industry is right under manufacturing with 53,521 paid employees. EEEEEK! You hear economists talk about what happens when we become more of a "low paying, service job" economy.

Note: Don't yell at me and say, "But YOU always want to promote the opening of new retail establishments!" I do in that they are a PART of the economic ecosystem, but I also promote new and bigger industries moving into the area or developing in the area.

Coming in fourth with 33,249 paid employees is what is defined as "Administrative & support & waste management & remediation service." (Tony Soprano?!) The detailed data http://www.census.gov/econ/census02/data/ny/NY029_56.HTM states that only approximately 738 of those are in the "Waste management & remediation services" area. (Sorry Tony Soprano.)


I wonder if #4 only made it there becasue of #1
Goverment waste?

[LHardy]

...why many of us were up in arms over two years ago and the same discussions continue today.
How's that for an educated public?

[WNYresident]

Simply put, there's not many other places to go.

There are LOTS of places to go. 49 other states anyone can go to to look for work. By having as many handouts as we have here your just enabling the welfare mentality.

I don't think the NYS/County social services want to see those people go. What would they do? If you can't FIND a job here then that means you LEAVE the area. It doesn't mean lets call NYS handout departments and learn how to live off the system for the rest of your lives.

I have nothing wrong with VERY short term help and helping the truely disabled.

[Achbek1]

There are LOTS of places to go. 49 other states anyone can go to to look for work. By having as many handouts as we have here your just enabling the welfare mentality.

I don't think the NYS/County social services want to see those people go. What would they do? If you can't FIND a job here then that means you LEAVE the area. It doesn't mean lets call NYS handout departments and learn how to live off the system for the rest of your lives.

I have nothing wrong with VERY short term help and helping the truely disabled.

The economic stats and the poverty stats just make us look even worse to potential business developers. They want to open in areas that are doing well, not unwell... But then again, the people who protest every damn new business probably aren't helping either. (And remember, it's not only retail that they protest.)

[4music]

I don't think the NYS/County social services want to see those people go. What would they do?


What facts do you have to support that statement? That statement implies that we (ECDSS employees) purposely keep clients so that we would have a job. That is simply untrue. Everyone I work with would like to see our clients better themselves and be totally self sufficient. Unfortunately, there is no easy and quick solution to have a client transition off of assistance. If there were it would have been done.

In my experience the issue of social services is not necessarily a county decision either. ECDSS exists because it is mandated by NYS and it's constitution. So to change anything about social services, a person has to start at the state level.

Of course that does not mean that the local level is off the hook either. ECDSS has some lawsuits pending due to non-compliance with timeliness issues. In other words, an application of services is supposed to have an approval or a denial within 30 days and it takes longer. In my honest opinion, most of the problem happened after the 2005 layoff when staffing was very low, some of due to retirements too, and some of it was due to poor paperflow and procedures. In a way the lawsuit is good because it forced ECDSS to streamline procedures and change things around. The bad thing is that it is still ongoing and could cost EC millions in fines and/or monetary sanctions. Yes, there was an increase in staffing which was scrutinized by the control board and legislature. I could go on about some of the positive changes that have taken place is the 2005 red/green budget but there is no time or space.

The point I am trying to make is that almost all, yes there is always the slacker worker, ECDSS employees are doing what we can to streamline and get costs under control. However, the majority of the problem lies beyond our control. What is the answer??????

[4music]

"I'm not here to subsidize someone's work ability. Just because they can't make it in the private sector doesn't mean they go work for the government at wages higher then they could get in the private sector."

What makes you think that just because people are civil servants that they could not make it in the private sector?

[WNYresident]

"I'm not here to subsidize someone's work ability. Just because they can't make it in the private sector doesn't mean they go work for the government at wages higher then they could get in the private sector."

What makes you think that just because people are civil servants that they could not make it in the private sector?

Because for the most do you ever hear civil servants leaving to work in the private sector?

I do know there are some very good civil servant workers. They are my clients. They complain about the dead wood just as much as people on the messageboards.

[LHardy]

What facts do you have to support that statement? That statement implies that we (ECDSS employees) purposely keep clients so that we would have a job. That is simply untrue. Everyone I work with would like to see our clients better themselves and be totally self sufficient. Unfortunately, there is no easy and quick solution to have a client transition off of assistance. If there were it would have been done.

If the numbers of people receiving social services was reduced so would be the jobs needed to handle the paper work. No clients, no need for employees.
The job has a vested interest in keeping people on welfare assistance.

It has been done and is done in many states. That is why they come to NYS. It's easy and once on, forever on, if you choose.

[leftWNYbecauseofBS]

What makes you think that just because people are civil servants that they could not make it in the private sector?

To flip the question, what makes you think that civil servants, as a whole, could cut it in the private sector?

If we are speaking in groups as a whole, it is a safer bet that people in the private sector would have no problem with the pace of the public sector.

[4music]

To flip the question, what makes you think that civil servants, as a whole, could cut it in the private sector?

If we are speaking in groups as a whole, it is a safer bet that people in the private sector would have no problem with the pace of the public sector.


Before I answer that question please define what you mean by success? Many different people have different answers because their goals or motivating factors are different. Just so you know, I have been in the private sector and still do my music business. I am also involved in my community as well. While I am not rich, I am happy in all I do. I am a well educated, self motivator, tenacious and a honest hard worker. I can't tolerate any slackers or waste of time and money in the public sector either. The people I work with have the same work ethic too.

Also I have posted info about myself in other threads.

[Cgoodsp466]

"I'm not here to subsidize someone's work ability. Just because they can't make it in the private sector doesn't mean they go work for the government at wages higher then they could get in the private sector."

What makes you think that just because people are civil servants that they could not make it in the private sector?

Those who cant work in the public sector.Walk in to any DMV office.I rest my case. A public sector employee does nothing to add $$$ to the economy.The money they have comes from me and the other hard working private sector people.Tell me again why I should work hard and make more money? I am tired of paying for these people.
My 401K lost money, are the public sector folks going to help me? I bet they want us to help them. Oh well these people have to do something with theire days.

[4music]

Those who cant work in the public sector.Walk in to any DMV office.I rest my case. A public sector employee does nothing to add $$$ to the economy.The money they have comes from me and the other hard working private sector people.Tell me again why I should work hard and make more money? I am tired of paying for these people.
My 401K lost money, are the public sector folks going to help me? I bet they want us to help them. Oh well these people have to do something with theire days.


You and I have had this discussion before and I am not going keep repeating something that I have told you before.

I will repeat this however: "The best I can do for you is to guarantee that I give 100% performance and skill on my job, to eradicate waste and maintain efficiency as best I can."

Check out the other threads that we were on. I realize and appreciate the hard work everyone does to pay taxes and would never think otherwise. I am also a taxpayer, one can say that I "pay my own wages", and I every penny I spend in the purchase of goods and services I add to the economy.

[Cgoodsp466]

You and I have had this discussion before and I am not going keep repeating something that I have told you before.

I will repeat this however: "The best I can do for you is to guarantee that I give 100% performance and skill on my job, to eradicate waste and maintain efficiency as best I can."

Check out the other threads that we were on. I realize and appreciate the hard work everyone does to pay taxes and would never think otherwise. I am also a taxpayer, one can say that I "pay my own wages", and I every penny I spend in the purchase of goods and services I add to the economy.


My point is you dont create wealth? My company makes parts that make cars run.My company creates Jobs. The Public sector never has or ever will generate one Dollar. Tell me why I should support someone who does nothing to help this economy move forward.Your wages come from me and the rest of the taxpayers who dont get a check from the county.You should be doing back flips trying to make me happy. I dont choose to pay any more of my HARD EARNED MONEY. I got my taxes back from the accountant today and I am just a little pissed off. I am paying more this year then last year.FOR FRIGGIN WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[4music]

My point is you dont create wealth? My company makes parts that make cars run.My company creates Jobs. The Public sector never has or ever will generate one Dollar. Tell me why I should support someone who does nothing to help this economy move forward.Your wages come from me and the rest of the taxpayers who dont get a check from the county.You should be doing back flips trying to make me happy. I dont choose to pay any more of my HARD EARNED MONEY. I got my taxes back from the accountant today and I am just a little pissed off. I am paying more this year then last year.FOR FRIGGIN WHAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I am not trying to change your opinion. Think what you want. All I ask is that you STOP generalizing ALL private sector people as worthless. You obviously are a very angry person and there just is no reasoning with you. Almost every post I happen to read from you on this message board is nothing but complaints and ridicule. The facts are this---you have to pay taxes. GROW UP and accept it or move away from this area or try to change things by getting involved with the change process. And if having money like you makes one miserable then I am really glad I make a modest income.

[Enough]

.....The facts are this---you have to pay taxes. GROW UP and accept it or move away from this area or try to change things by getting involved with the change process.
It's kinda like the "chicken and the egg" theory.

1st of all, it's real simple to say, "accept it or move away". If you have noticed by our census numbers that is exactly what people have done. You are right in a way, we are the stupid ones for staying. I guess some of us had more vision than others. I don't think many of us realized it would ever be like this.

You are asking someone to sacrifice time and money to get involved with a process and people that he detests. People don't have that kind of time or money to invest. When you're working 50-60+ hours a week it's difficult to turn down overtime or take time away from family to go fight for a losing cause.

It's kinda like the 30 people that show up screaming at a Town Board meeting to fight a new Wal-Mart. Then you drive by Wal-Mart on a Saturday and see a parking lot overflowing with people.

[4music]

It's kinda like the "chicken and the egg" theory.

1st of all, it's real simple to say, "accept it or move away". If you have noticed by our census numbers that is exactly what people have done. You are right in a way, we are the stupid ones for staying. I guess some of us had more vision than others. I don't think many of us realized it would ever be like this.

You are asking someone to sacrifice time and money to get involved with a process and people that he detests. People don't have that kind of time or money to invest. When you're working 50-60+ hours a week it's difficult to turn down overtime or take time away from family to go fight for a losing cause.

It's kinda like the 30 people that show up screaming at a Town Board meeting to fight a new Wal-Mart. Then you drive by Wal-Mart on a Saturday and see a parking lot overflowing with people.

And I agree with you. The price of everything has gone up not just the taxes. And if one was to sit down and figure the cost of everything that a household pays on a yearly basis you would probably find that your property and income taxes are the least amount compared with what one pays for mortgages, utilities, entertainment, etc. The the way some posters write it's as if taxes were the only expense they have.

What most people are is frustrated with the whole system, the waste that goes with it and the hopless feeling one has over it all. AND SO AM I. Imagine that-- a civil servant frustrated with the whole ball of wax in goverment-- my, my what is the world coming to!!!

The whole issue of gov't cost starts with the politicians and ourselves as taxpayers who elected them. The unions also play a part in this as well. They are as much a bureaucracy as a government. Blaming the rank and file for all of this is not correct and calling us names like free cheesers and short bus people, or assertions like, we don't contribute to the economy, is just plain childish.

I never said that the change process was easy. The "system" is the way it is because the general public is very apathetic and does not want to be involved. The change process does not have to take a large chunk of time or money unless you take it to a higher level. Space is tight here so I don't want to give a lesson on civics. One example, I am involved with the community as much as I can. As a community activist I try to keep up on issues as best as I can to what is going on in my city and county. My councilman and county legislator knows me because I often call them with issues and concerns. I feel as though I am keeping them on their toes and keeping them honest. And I don't mean calling and yelling at them. That accomplishes nothing. I try to have a REASONABLE solution to every complaint I make. By reasonable I mean DOABLE not just "get rid of the lot of them" mentality.

I am not going to apologize for being a civil servant. Simply put, the county had a job that needed to be filled, I took an exam and was hired. As for the taxpayers the best I can do for you as a civil servant is to guarantee that I give 100% performance and skill on my job, to eradicate waste and maintain efficiency as best I can.

[Cgoodsp466]

I am not trying to change your opinion. Think what you want. All I ask is that you STOP generalizing ALL private sector people as worthless. You obviously are a very angry person and there just is no reasoning with you. Almost every post I happen to read from you on this message board is nothing but complaints and ridicule. The facts are this---you have to pay taxes. GROW UP and accept it or move away from this area or try to change things by getting involved with the change process. And if having money like you makes one miserable then I am really glad I make a modest income.

I should not be punished for working hard.I should not be required to pay your salary.I am going to cut back,I dont need to make next year what I made this year to live.I would rather make less and pay the Government less.
So I am going to take a page out of your book.Work half the time and live off your dime. My change includes a ball bat.Some Tar and feathers.You are the joke of the day.Long the the public sector worker. Get over yourself what you do doesent make my life any better. If it was up to me your public sector income would be Zero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[4music]

I should not be punished for working hard.I should not be required to pay your salary.I am going to cut back,I dont need to make next year what I made this year to live.I would rather make less and pay the Government less.
So I am going to take a page out of your book.Work half the time and live off your dime. My change includes a ball bat.Some Tar and feathers.You are the joke of the day.Long the the public sector worker. Get over yourself what you do doesent make my life any better. If it was up to me your public sector income would be Zero!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You obviously haven't read any of my posts otherwise you would know what I stand for. Just remember I bought a car, with the money I earned as a civil servant, which uses parts that probably was made by your company. If I don't buy a car because I have no money YOU WON"T EITHER!! Oh well, you play the "victim" well just whining and bit**** with no REAL solutions. Grow up and be the man you contend to be. The problem in this area are apatheic whiners like you. So my advice is to look in the mirror and blame yourself for not being involved in making sure your political representative votes the way you wanted.

[Cgoodsp466]

You obviously haven't read any of my posts otherwise you would know what I stand for. Just remember I bought a car, with the money I earned as a civil servant, which uses parts that probably was made by your company. If I don't buy a car because I have no money YOU WON"T EITHER!! Oh well, you play the "victim" well just whining and bit**** with no REAL solutions. Grow up and be the man you contend to be. The problem in this area are apatheic whiners like you. So my advice is to look in the mirror and blame yourself for not being involved in making sure your political representative votes the way you wanted.

Civil Servant? now thats an Oxy Moron! We will always disagree becuase we are enemies and always will be.I vote in every election,and get the same results. I will never support anyone who takes money away from people.So live your life of public service,you hate me and I hate you. Now when you feel froggy leap.:p

[4music]

[QUOTE=Cgoodsp466]Civil Servant? now thats an Oxy Moron! We will always disagree becuase we are enemies and always will be.I vote in every election,and get the same results. I will never support anyone who takes money away from people.So live your life of public service,you hate me and I hate you. Now when you feel froggy leap.:p[/QU

I never said I hated you. And I never said you had to support me. You are putting words in my mouth and you need to stop that. It must really suck to be you, so angry and miserable all the time. You obviously have a problem if you hate me as much as you say.

Once again I will not apologize for being a civil servant. I don't foolishly take money away from the taxpayers. I respect them. They need someone of my skill and work ethic and I do expect to be compensated. I will not work for nothing and neither do you. It took me 26 years to get to the pay level I am at where my friends in the private sector got within a two to five years from being hired. I am not complaining because I feel I do one hell of a good job and once again if you REALLY READ and UNDERSTOOD what I have posted in the other threads you would know what I stand for. Now you need to go stand in the corner for a time out after having such a temper tantrum. :p :p :D

[Cgoodsp466]

[QUOTE=Cgoodsp466]Civil Servant? now thats an Oxy Moron! We will always disagree becuase we are enemies and always will be.I vote in every election,and get the same results. I will never support anyone who takes money away from people.So live your life of public service,you hate me and I hate you. Now when you feel froggy leap.:p[/QU

I never said I hated you. And I never said you had to support me. You are putting words in my mouth and you need to stop that. It must really suck to be you, so angry and miserable all the time. You obviously have a problem if you hate me as much as you say.

Once again I will not apologize for being a civil servant. I don't foolishly take money away from the taxpayers. I respect them. They need someone of my skill and work ethic and I do expect to be compensated. I will not work for nothing and neither do you. It took me 26 years to get to the pay level I am at where my friends in the private sector got within a two to five years from being hired. I am not complaining because I feel I do one hell of a good job and once again if you REALLY READ and UNDERSTOOD what I have posted in the other threads you would know what I stand for. Now you need to go stand in the corner for a time out after having such a temper tantrum. :p :p :D

You know we hate each other,If i have the chance to make a difference and get your layer of Government removed from the public payroll I will do it in a heart beat.and you know if you get a chance to bone me for more of my tax money you wont hesitate to pull the trigger.This is what this world has come to get used to it.No tantrum the truth.The object of war is to get the other guy before he gets you.I am at war with the public sector nothing personel. :D

[4music]

[QUOTE=4music]

You know we hate each other,If i have the chance to make a difference and get your layer of Government removed from the public payroll I will do it in a heart beat.and you know if you get a chance to bone me for more of my tax money you wont hesitate to pull the trigger.This is what this world has come to get used to it.No tantrum the truth.The object of war is to get the other guy before he gets you.I am at war with the public sector nothing personel. :D

Sounds to me like you should have volunteered to go to Vietnam while you were in the Coast Guard. Then at least you would know what real war is all about.

However, go on and fight your own private war with the public sector. I will do as I have always done, give the taxpayers an honest days work. Bye Bye for now.

[Cgoodsp466]

[QUOTE=Cgoodsp466]

Sounds to me like you should have volunteered to go to Vietnam while you were in the Coast Guard. Then at least you would know what real war is all about.

However, go on and fight your own private war with the public sector. I will do as I have always done, give the taxpayers an honest days work. Bye Bye for now.


Spoken like a true Bundist.Oh their are thousands like me so ta ta.

[4music]

"Spoken like a true Bundist.Oh their are thousands like me so ta ta."


You need to learn to spell, Bundist? Their?

[Cgoodsp466]

"Spoken like a true Bundist.Oh their are thousands like me so ta ta."


You need to learn to spell, Bundist? Their?

Hey Johhny Jerkoff. Their ya go.



bundist
One entry found.

bund[2,noun]



Main Entry: 2bund
Pronunciation: \ˈbu̇nd, ˈbənd, ˈbu̇nt\
Function: noun
Usage: often capitalized
Etymology: Yiddish bund & German Bund, from Middle High German bunt; akin to Old English byndel
Date: 1850
: a political association: as a: a Jewish socialist organization founded in czarist Russia in 1897 b: a pro-Nazi German-American organization of the 1930s
— bund·ist \ˈbu̇n-dist, ˈbən-\ noun often capitalized

[4music]

Hey Johhny Jerkoff. Their ya go.



bundist
One entry found.

bund[2,noun]



Main Entry: 2bund
Pronunciation: \ˈbu̇nd, ˈbənd, ˈbu̇nt\
Function: noun
Usage: often capitalized
Etymology: Yiddish bund & German Bund, from Middle High German bunt; akin to Old English byndel
Date: 1850
: a political association: as a: a Jewish socialist organization founded in czarist Russia in 1897 b: a pro-Nazi German-American organization of the 1930s
— bund·ist \ˈbu̇n-dist, ˈbən-\ noun often capitalized


Ok I stand corrected. I thought you meant Buddhist.

[Cgoodsp466]

Ok I stand corrected. I thought you meant Buddhist.

I love the Dolly Lama,he is a Nudist Monk

[4music]

I love the Dolly Lama,he is a Nudist Monk

What about Dolly Parton?

[Cgoodsp466]

What about Dolly Parton?

A person can only dream.Huba Huba

[Rocksimm]

Civil Servant? now thats an Oxy Moron! We will always disagree becuase we are enemies and always will be.I vote in every election,and get the same results. I will never support anyone who takes money away from people.So live your life of public service,you hate me and I hate you. Now when you feel froggy leap.:p

You hate someone simply because they work for the government?

You are not willing to engage in any constructive debate with someone becasue they happen to work for the government?

Instead you would prefer to spew venom at someone who is making concrete points (whether you agree with them or not), rather than counter those points.

I hope you realize that your exchanges with other people who present well thought out views resemble the four year old who your arguing with who consistently counters, na ah.

Once again, this type of thought is exactly what has been sinking this region for decades.

[winfield31]

When I started in the public gov't "sector" , I was at or near the "bottom" of the wage earners in WNY........My friends at Chevy , Ford , Harrison , JH Williams , American Optical , etc. laughed at me as they were making double/triple & even more then me............I "stayed" the course , but because I now have a salary that is "above" the average Buffalonian (but not the average guy from Clarence , Wheatfield , Eden , Hamburg , Orchard Park , Lancaster , etc.) I'm the "bad guy" gov't worker who's "stealing" my livelihood from the taxpayers in WNY ? Particularly Buffalo , where most people are just getting "up" at 10:30 AM to make sure they "catch" "The Price Is Right" ! I "invested" my education & working skills to make Buffalo a better place & I do it it EVERY day , I live here also.......NEVER have I collected a Welfare check , or unemployment insurance , etc. ! So , respectfully , "screw you" if you live in Buffalo OR the "lilly-white , pristeen" burb's & make "less" then I , I earned it........I believe you've earned what you sowed also.............

[Cgoodsp466]

You hate someone simply because they work for the government?

You are not willing to engage in any constructive debate with someone becasue they happen to work for the government?

Instead you would prefer to spew venom at someone who is making concrete points (whether you agree with them or not), rather than counter those points.

I hope you realize that your exchanges with other people who present well thought out views resemble the four year old who your arguing with who consistently counters, na ah.

Once again, this type of thought is exactly what has been sinking this region for decades.

You know I have read this post and it is a fallacy of logic. I dont spew venom I spew the truth , so if you dont like the truth please I bid you adieu.

[Cgoodsp466]

When I started in the public gov't "sector" , I was at or near the "bottom" of the wage earners in WNY........My friends at Chevy , Ford , Harrison , JH Williams , American Optical , etc. laughed at me as they were making double/triple & even more then me............I "stayed" the course , but because I now have a salary that is "above" the average Buffalonian (but not the average guy from Clarence , Wheatfield , Eden , Hamburg , Orchard Park , Lancaster , etc.) I'm the "bad guy" gov't worker who's "stealing" my livelihood from the taxpayers in WNY ? Particularly Buffalo , where most people are just getting "up" at 10:30 AM to make sure they "catch" "The Price Is Right" ! I "invested" my education & working skills to make Buffalo a better place & I do it it EVERY day , I live here also.......NEVER have I collected a Welfare check , or unemployment insurance , etc. ! So , respectfully , "screw you" if you live in Buffalo OR the "lilly-white , pristeen" burb's & make "less" then I , I earned it........I believe you've earned what you sowed also.............

Wow I am impressed you are the mother Terresa of public servents. I spend over 160 nights in hotels and drive 47,000 miles per year to pay the salaries of folks like you. Tell me again why I work so hard? The more I make the more you take. Keep up the good work I am cutting back. Boost Buffalo its good for you.

[winfield31]

Wow I am impressed you are the mother Terresa of public servents. I spend over 160 nights in hotels and drive 47,000 miles per year to pay the salaries of folks like you. Tell me again why I work so hard? The more I make the more you take. Keep up the good work I am cutting back. Boost Buffalo its good for you.:confused: you think I don't work "paychech to paycheck" ? NO ONE "hands" me money , they pay me a fair days pay & I give them a fair days labor , they owe me nothing & I owe them nothing more , I am a man who chose my path many moons ago , no one told you to drive your truck , no one chose for you , I SURE didn't...........This is a line similiar from a John Wayne movie "McClintock"..........look it up..........BTW , I wish you could here me playin' the world's smallest violin for ya............

[Cgoodsp466]

:confused: you think I don't work "paychech to paycheck" ? NO ONE "hands" me money , they pay me a fair days pay & I give them a fair days labor , they owe me nothing & I owe them nothing more , I am a man who chose my path many moons ago , no one told you to drive your truck , no one chose for you , I SURE didn't...........This is a line similiar from a John Wayne movie "McClintock"..........look it up..........BTW , I wish you could here me playin' the world's smallest violin for ya............

I dont drive a truck! I wish I was in the Teamsters Union these guys have a sweet retirement,and they earn every dime of it. So Rosin up your bow and play me a tune.Some day you will pay the piper as we all will. At least I can say I did it my way,Frank Sinatra look it up.

[4music]

You know I have read this post and it is a fallacy of logic. I dont spew venom I spew the truth , so if you dont like the truth please I bid you adieu.


Oh, you speak the truth all right!! For a person like yourself operating under FLAWED LOGIC. And I find it absolutely hilarious that everytime someone points out the flawed thinking you operate under you resort to name calling and belittling. THAT'S real mature of you (sarcasm!!!).:p :p

[winfield31]

I dont drive a truck! I wish I was in the Teamsters Union these guys have a sweet retirement,and they earn every dime of it. So Rosin up your bow and play me a tune.Some day you will pay the piper as we all will. At least I can say I did it my way,Frank Sinatra look it up.Ok , so you drive your vehicle to Dayton & back , YOU chose that life & employment , don'y judge me for the job & "gamble" I chose many moons ago........My gamble tuened out OK , I won't be paying to no "piper".......In fact to save time & money , take 10% off your next tax bill & drop it off directly at my house..............cash , no checks...........:) P.S. "I Did It My Way" also................

[Cgoodsp466]

Oh, you speak the truth all right!! For a person like yourself operating under FLAWED LOGIC. And I find it absolutely hilarious that everytime someone points out the flawed thinking you operate under you resort to name calling and belittling. THAT'S real mature of you (sarcasm!!!).:p :p

I am 58 years old Smoke 6 cigars a day and Drink Scotch "Grouse" I dont have a mature or serious bone in my body. Thats why I have no gray hair. I love my way of thinking,you guys should really get over your selves. I know that you are ambidextrous and you will probably have to wear glasses some day. Come in to the light Luke.

[Cgoodsp466]

Ok , so you drive your vehicle to Dayton & back , YOU chose that life & employment , don'y judge me for the job & "gamble" I chose many moons ago........My gamble tuened out OK , I won't be paying to no "piper".......In fact to save time & money , take 10% off your next tax bill & drop it off directly at my house..............cash , no checks...........:) P.S. "I Did It My Way" also................

You wont be paying any Piper.

[winfield31]

I am 58 years old Smoke 6 cigars a day and Drink Scotch "Grouse" I dont have a mature or serious bone in my body. Thats why I have no gray hair. I love my way of thinking,you guys should really get over your selves. I know that you are ambidextrous and you will probably have to wear glasses some day. Come in to the light Luke.I didn't know 4music's daddy was Darth.............BTW I do wear glasses , they did warn me if I don't stop , someday I'll go blind............but I did at least ask if I had to pay the IRS for my rhodenizing.............

[winfield31]

You wont be paying any Piper.or paying "pimpers' either..........they don't call me the "NON-SPITZER GUY" for nothing...........:)

[Cgoodsp466]

I didn't know 4music's daddy was Darth.............BTW I do wear glasses , they did warn me if I don't stop , someday I'll go blind............but I did at least ask if I had to pay the IRS for my rhodenizing.............

That funny,I dont care what any body says thats funny. Have a good night we will play again tommorow:D

[winfield31]

That funny,I dont care what any body says thats funny. Have a good night we will play again tommorow:Dtake care cgood.............;)

[4music]

I am 58 years old Smoke 6 cigars a day and Drink Scotch "Grouse" I dont have a mature or serious bone in my body. Thats why I have no gray hair. I love my way of thinking,you guys should really get over your selves. I know that you are ambidextrous and you will probably have to wear glasses some day. Come in to the light Luke.

Well I'm glad you finally admit to not being mature or having a serious bone in your body. But I think you really should call me Leia --- I'm a woman. Therefore, I wear glasses because I have bad eyes and not because of what you are referring to. HE HE. And that raspy breathing sound I though was "DAD" is really you -- from smoking all those cigars. Imagine that.

Oh and you are not much older than I - Pops,